Paedomorphic C. ensicauda

[TJ]

Here it is as of today

I wouldn't know how to assess sexual maturity, but here's a close-up of the cloaca:

 

[jesper]

Wow, is the average female c.o. 10 cm?

 

[jesper]

It sure looks as if you have got something special going there Tim!

 

[kei]

Is this true C.ensicauda larva?
Looks very different Tim.

 

[TJ]

Hi Kei,

This was among larvae from that 150-cm-long tank of mine, which has mostly C. ensicauda popei in it along with some C. pyrrhogaster. There is no record (that I'm aware of, at least) of a paedomorphic ensicauda, so who's to say what a paedomorphic is supposed to look like?

 

[TJ]

I originally drew attention to this larvae back in October 2003. You can see the pics of it then
at:

http://www.caudata.org/forum/messages/13/6959.html

 

[john]

My bet's on a female - tail length and cloaca shape. Tim, do you have a male sibling of it? Try breeding the two together: you may "create" a largely paedomorphic race of popei .

 

[TJ]

No, I don't know which ones its siblings are anymore as I was pretty disorganized at the time and it came from a tank with many adults.

Also, I am not sure whether a normal C. ensicauda male would even be attracted to a paedomorphic female, but it's sure worth a try

Here "she" is today:

 

[jesse]

a female is a female, im sure that an adult male would be attracted to her, do you have her in a set up with adults?

 

[garrison]

I know I'm not the first to say this Tim but it looks like there has been a reduction in gill size since previous posts. Either that or she's just grown so much that her gills seem dwarfed

 

[benjamin]

She looks like she's put on some weight.

 

[TJ]

An up-to-date pic.

She's now about a year and a half old and measures 11 cm:

I'm also raising a Hynobius tokyoensis larvae that hasn't morphed for about a year now and a Tylototriton kweichowensis that hasn't morphed since I got it back in early August, at which time it was about two months old. I don't know what it is. They do get plenty to eat and are not kept in an exceptionally cool environment.

 

[frank]

Interesting, this animal might have a problem with its thyroid (sorry guys, I don't know the English term). A lack of sufficient thyroid hormones is known to lead to neoteny. Besides, its overall black colour may support this (lack of thyroid hormone (release) in other animals may result in increased black pigmentation). I have seen some 5 cases of hypothyroidism in urodelans (mainly in Salamandra), leading to gouter and developmental problems.

 

[TJ]

Thanks for that input, Frank.

Bad picture, but here it is as of last night, without having morphed.

No major change in size over the last half year. If anything, it has become a bit shorter as I measured it as slightly under 11 cm.

(Message edited by TJ on October 28, 2005)

 

[john]

That monster must be 2 years old now Tim!

 

[TJ]

Sorry John but I didn't notice your post until now

Yep, she (he?!) is over 2 years now, though I need to do my age calculations to ascertain how much older. I did come across an old unposted shot of it the other day <font size="-2">(not any of those posted below)</font> taken before I ever posted anything about it here.

But hey, the strangest thing has happened. At first I thought my eyes were fooling me, but it's vent coloration has turned blue, the same type of chalky blue seen on the sides (but not vent!) of some male C. pyrrhogaster when they're in breeding dress.

I'm both fascinated but perplexed. I've never seen such a thing with any of my Cynops before, be it with C. ensicauda or C. pyrrhogaster. The above two photos have only been sharpened, no toying with the contrast. Its vent is blue to the naked eye as well.

Its tail also seems to have grown even longer, almost obscenely long relative to its body size

Any possible explanations for the vent "sheen"? Frank, would this strengthen or weaken your theory of possible hypothyroidism ?

It just occurred to me that in the previous photos I posted of this animal in August, if one looks closely the belly seems blue in those too.

It's kept in a separate tank of its own, and was only removed for these photos. It's a very skittish creature, and moves extremely fast. I rarely get a chance to get a good look at it, much less to get decent photos of it, which is to explain why I didn't notice this before.

(Message edited by TJ on October 28, 2005)

 

[TJ]

And now, looking back at some of the earlier pics (even before August), its vent was somewhat bluish before -- I'll grant that

-- but certainly not as blue as it is now...

But as can be seen in the following picture, it's also a factor of light and contrast, as the blue doesn't come through much at all here:

<font size="-2">(flash in use)</font>

(Message edited by TJ on October 28, 2005)

 

[garrison]

Wow, very impressive, and odd creature. It seems you have an ensicauda from another planet

I'm interested in what your thoughts are on breeding this animal, but I'm really wondering if it's own species even recognizes it now?!?

 

[john]

I would imagine all of the typical chemical signals would be employed by this individual to indicate it's identity, so yes probably the other specimens recognize it as the same. Only a guess though.

 

[TJ]

I'd like to breed it eventually, if that's possible. First I'd like to be able to confirm its sex. Also, I'm waiting for it to become bigger before mixing it with other newts.