why are people so serious about their newts?

[Molch]

When they do, the fluffy group takes offense to the no-nonsense demeanor of the scientists, and call them rude. Scientists, generally, have awkward social skills and cannot comprehend why someone's offended.

Bwuaaahhaaa! Evil mad scientist is OFFAAANDED (note hysterical caps and requisite misspelling) at this statement.

We scientists have BRILLIANT social skills. We go to parties all the time where we drink beer and wine and OTHER STUFF TOO and actually TALK (!) to other people and the bold ones among us even make EYE CONTACT!!!

No-nonsense? Har Har (evil mad scientist laugh). ALL we do is nonsense; we know it, we write about it in secret magazines that only scientists can read, but the taxpayers don't because when we talk to THEM (those fluffy folk) we're all stuffy and pompous so they'll be IMPRESSED and give us more grant money. Works ALL the time!!!

Take THAT, Fluffballz! :kill:

 

[SludgeMunkey]

Wait...

They give us money for pretending to be smart?


Hmm... perhaps I need to strive to be more pompous, arrogant and sober.

Guess I need to give up whiskey and anhydrous ethanol for Tequilla....

 

[Kaysie]

Molch, I want to go to your parties! All of the nerd-parties I've been to do indeed involve copious amounts of beer (if herpers know anything, it's how to be drunk as a newt), but then it degenerates into the "one time, in vet school" stories. Fantastic if youre into explosive expression of the anal glands of a shih tzu, not so fantastic for polite company.

And I can stand behind both Jake and Johnny's statements: Jake is one of the nicest people I know (and has the best hair). Johnny has difficulty keeping his trap shut long enough to chew, but I had a great time. It's not often I get rapid-fire herp chat.

 

[freves]

When I first noticed that this thread had resurfaced I seriously thought that it was only about 6 months old...where have I been for the last four years? That's right, raising a kid.

 

[Kaysie]

Holy ****, Chip. Your kid's 4 already?! Last I remember, he wasn't even crawling yet!

 

[robinsonmatt43]

I understand what you're saying Koala; I have only been a member of this fourm for a couple of weeks, but during that short period I have realised that there's quite a few people on here, all with varying degrees of experience in amphibian husbandry and care.

I think everyone has had at least one experience in their lives in which someone who knows more on a particular subject makes you feel at little stupid. From what I understand, this site is dedicated to everyone and anyone who is interested in these animals. Being rude to someone because they ask a simple or fundamental question on the subject is totally unneccessary and frankly, pretty pathetic.

 

[SludgeMunkey]

I understand what you're saying Koala; I have only been a member of this fourm for a couple of weeks, but during that short period I have realised that there's quite a few people on here, all with varying degrees of experience in amphibian husbandry and care.

I think everyone has had at least one experience in their lives in which someone who knows more on a particular subject makes you feel at little stupid. From what I understand, this site is dedicated to everyone and anyone who is interested in these animals. Being rude to someone because they ask a simple or fundamental question on the subject is totally unneccessary and frankly, pretty pathetic.

I disagree with you....partially. There is no need for rudeness, but many contrive a simple answer as rude....which is frankly pathetic in that they could have spent the time with a few mouse clicks instead of getting their feelings hurt.


Simple or fundamental questions do not need to be asked if one bothers to utilize the extensive resources this site and its sisters present. Many of these folks have ten years worth of work putting together the "beginner's' lists.

 

[freves]

Hi Kaysie,
Time flies He is actually only three and a half though.

 

[Azhael]

If in a post there are no smilies, no silly commentaries or humour, it doesn´t make the post rude or snippy. It makes it concise and to the point.
I´m a big fan of being silly and just generally nerdy, but not every single post needs to include stuff like that. People are way too sensitive...this is a forum for exchanging information and experience, getting mad because people are actually spending time in giving you that info just because they didn´t go out of their way to make it humorous or cute is just ridiculous. People are too fragile and sheltered.
It´s so very true that the internet completely changes the intention and tone of some commentaries. I know i´ve had rows with some people that were caused almost exclusively by a missunderstanding of intent.
There´s an exception when i feel being purposefully rude or snippy is totally justified and that´s when people ignore advice. If someone has already ignored your advice and keeps making the same question, or if that person is doing something morally wrong but won´t accept criticism for it, then i´d say it´s open season. Ridicule is the only thing that i think has any chance of making such people change their ways.


I´ll end up by saying that if there is one thing that annoys the hell out of me is when people who like to delve into more advanced stuff or who are just actually interested in expanding their knowledge, are branded elitists or asked to stop participating (this one reaaaaaaaally makes me want to kill) because someone who has no desire to learn is bothered by information they can´t or don´t want to understand. In this forum there is room for everybody....if we have to put up with hundreds of posts about how cute an axolotl is and how it likes to play becuse "it´s a very special and clever little axie, you know, it likes being tickled", then by the gods, when anybody else tries to actually share valuable information, shut up and take it or just don´t read it, but DO NOT have the gigantic balls to tell them that what they are posting doesn´t belong or is not relevant.


Argh....that felt nice

 

[robinsonmatt43]

I understand what you're saying Koala; I have only been a member of this fourm for a couple of weeks, but during that short period I have realised that there's quite a few people on here, all with varying degrees of experience in amphibian husbandry and care.

I think everyone has had at least one experience in their lives in which someone who knows more on a particular subject makes you feel at little stupid. From what I understand, this site is dedicated to everyone and anyone who is interested in these animals. Being rude to someone because they ask a simple or fundamental question on the subject is totally unneccessary and frankly, pretty pathetic.

Fair enough Johnny. I was simple symapthizng with Koala's experience, as I personally have had similar experiences in which someone unnecessarily makes me feel like an idiot simply for asking a question.

However, I do agree with you that simple questions can often be answered by doing a little independant research online or at the library. But let me ask you this, as a site contibutor and moderator, I can only assume that an individual makes him or herself available to share their extensive experience and knowledge on the subject with others. Who's to say what's a relevant question....or a dumb question? Furthermore, if a contributor on the site deems a question to be too mundate to warrant an apporpreate response, then why not just not answer the individual, and let someone who has more time and patience for beginner questions answer the person. Perhaps this would avoid trite and curt response that may be be interpreted as rude. And yes, I understand that a trite response might be interpreted as rudeness, even if it wasn't intentional.

But I have to say, I have not seen the response that Koala was refering to, so I guess I can't really form an opinion based on information I havn't seen.

In my experience though, since being a member on here, I have recieved nothing but curteous and helpful response to questions I have posted.

 

[Nowicki418]

There is some information that a herp enthusiast may think of as a "basic" or "simple" that is not easily found using books and online resources. For example, many people do not know that there is such thing as amphibian ecdysis. Very few resources talk about it and care guides often don't even mention it. I could see an amateur in a panic posting a question about this strange substance covering their pet. I personally know the frustration of spending hours researching a topic only to have someone else explain it to me as if it were common knowledge.

Just because someone asks a basic question, doesn't necessarily mean they didn't try to research it first. Most of the information about salamander care I have seen online is on this very website. If they are new here and do not know how to use Caudata, external resources may not be so helpful.

Also keep in mind that wildlife in general doesn't receive as much attention as it needs, and herps aren't exactly regarded very highly within that group. There are many people who not only lack an interest in these animals but hate them for being creepy and slimy creatures. With what little resources and people we have; we need to be as efficient as possible. Those who are new to the world of salamanders, or any other aspect of nature, need encouragement not rejection for asking too many basic questions.

But I do see the point being made against "spoon-feeding" such individuals.

 

[Azhael]

I have no problem with answering basic questions in general. I have made the same post with basic stuff about H.orientalis, with the same words and in the same bloody order, a hundred times. It´s not a problem as long as the person is genuinely seeking advice. However, it is extremely enfuriating when somebody asks those questions while there is a post with exactly the information they need right below the one they just made.
I think it´s a matter of just not being insuferably lazy. If someone has clearly done nothing in way of research, and it´s blatant that they have just found the site and started making questions expecting everybody else to spoon feed them, then the way i see it that person deserves no niceties, and if there´s anyone out there with the stomach to actually waste time in answering them, then even if that person is rude i find it difficult to judge them for it. We´ve had some really astonishing cases of people demanding (yeah, not asking) answers to very basic questions that are answered all over the place, literally hundreds of times.
I´m computer illiterate...i have the habilities of a quadrapegic porpoise when it comes to finding my way through a new site or even a computer game. I´m laughably incompetent. Mind you, even i can manage to scroll down a page and read the titles of the threads, or use the search function. Furthermore, even if someone hasn´t found their way in the treasure land that is CC, there are plenty of us who display links in our signatures.

So, yeah, i´m fine with answering basic questions, as i know most of the users are, but there are limits....sometimes people are just offensively lazy and when it´s coupled with the fact that some people ask but don´t read, then it can really be too much. I realize it´s not conducive to the air of niceness that luckily we have in this site, but with people who really take it to a extreme, i really don´t care if others are rude to them, because even if being rude ends up causing the person to leave, there´s no actual loss, that person wasn´t going to contribute anything to the site anyway, plus they were the ones being incredibly rude in the first place. Nobody gets payed for contributing to this site. There´s nothing ruder than asking others to waste their precious time on you and then ignore them.

 

[SludgeMunkey]

But let me ask you this, as a site contibutor and moderator, I can only assume that an individual makes him or herself available to share their extensive experience and knowledge on the subject with others.

True, but not all of us are "experts" in everything. I am more of the "scary geek in the basement at large that does strange experiments".
Ecdysis really does't fall into the simple questions category as by definition it is a function of invertebrates.

But I do see the point being made against "spoon-feeding" such individuals.

Those are the words I was grasping at. Spoon-feeding and hand-carrying folks, new or not is unacceptable to me personally. I had to learn a lot of this stuff pre-interwebs...and most of it was by trial and error as books on caudates were a bit rare in the library back in the '80s and '90s. And frankly, learning new things truly is the fun in this hobby. You don't get into slimy stuff for hugs and kisses.

I have no problem with answering basic questions in general. I have made the same post with basic stuff about H.orientalis, with the same words and in the same bloody order, a hundred times. It´s not a problem as long as the person is genuinely seeking advice. However, it is extremely enfuriating when somebody asks those questions while there is a post with exactly the information they need right below the one they just made.
I think it´s a matter of just not being insuferably lazy. If someone has clearly done nothing in way of research, and it´s blatant that they have just found the site and started making questions expecting everybody else to spoon feed them, then the way i see it that person deserves no niceties, and if there´s anyone out there with the stomach to actually waste time in answering them, then even if that person is rude i find it difficult to judge them for it. We´ve had some really astonishing cases of people demanding (yeah, not asking) answers to very basic questions that are answered all over the place, literally hundreds of times.
I´m computer illiterate...i have the habilities of a quadrapegic porpoise when it comes to finding my way through a new site or even a computer game. I´m laughably incompetent. Mind you, even i can manage to scroll down a page and read the titles of the threads, or use the search function. Furthermore, even if someone hasn´t found their way in the treasure land that is CC, there are plenty of us who display links in our signatures.

So, yeah, i´m fine with answering basic questions, as i know most of the users are, but there are limits....sometimes people are just offensively lazy and when it´s coupled with the fact that some people ask but don´t read, then it can really be too much. I realize it´s not conducive to the air of niceness that luckily we have in this site, but with people who really take it to a extreme, i really don´t care if others are rude to them, because even if being rude ends up causing the person to leave, there´s no actual loss, that person wasn´t going to contribute anything to the site anyway, plus they were the ones being incredibly rude in the first place. Nobody gets payed for contributing to this site. There´s nothing ruder than asking others to waste their precious time on you and then ignore them.

Better man than I you are, I get far too frustrated with posts like "What Temperature?" or "What do I feed to them?". Call me a %^#$%$@^, but you do not even have to look hard for these answers. Heck, you could randomly click on the screen with your eyes closed and answer those...

 

[nwmnnaturalist]

Don't ya just love these threads that seem to come back to life?

I take the care of any of my critters quite seriously, no matter how primitive their nervous systems may be. When a living being is in your care, whether it's a plant, animal, or anything else, I believe you have a responsibility to provide the best care possible for their well being, even when it means accepting you are over your head or need help.

On the other hand, I try to be as nice and polite as possible with people who don't seem as educated or passionate as I am. I see it as an opportunity to educate others. But there are times where I feel that more blunt, sometimes 'harsh' words are necessary, such as when someone is openly being cruel or lazy.

I admit, I have that urge to look down on others who don't share my experience, seem as educated or as passionate as I am. I think everyone does to some extent. It's how we deal with that urge that counts. None of us are perfect. The saying 'you catch more flies with honey than vinegar' is something I try to keep in mind. I like to think I'm a light-hearted person, and I can be quite silly and a bit immature at times. But I don't believe that means I don't take things seriously as well.

I always like to fall back on the saying "Don't take everything you hear on the internet so seriously." ^^

 

[Shadow]

To me, I see it almost like the truth hurts...Lol.

I imagine being a moderator can be quite stressful at times - No doubt about it! Constantly answering the same questions, telling people to search (In which I have been told)

However, if it floats your boat then it doesn't matter, as long as you enjoy your hobby. Doesn't mean you care less for other animals etc.

I think people do a great job on this forum and I would like to thank everyone on here.

 

[snootyfox]

I don't have any new points to add really, but felt I needed to react - I can totes understand why some people would get tired of reading the same posts all the time - "My axie won't eat, my newt won't swim, my p.watl is failing at 5th year algebra"... but I just wanted to say that this is a forum. When you put something out to the world - especially a multi-country and culture world where people might not be as eloquent or as au fait with the english language as yourself (myself example - I'm a native english speaker but sometimes what I'm trying to say doesnt always come across right!) - you are opening yourself up to any sort of answer. It's actually great to receive answers at all - It means someone has seen the little lighthouse of contact you have put up, and wanted to make contact back.

At the end of the day - whether you are a herp enthusiast, or a hobbyist, or a breeder or someone who just likes to look at pictures of newts on google image search - we are a minority. My local pet store owner doesn't get the difference between an Axolotl and an Anderson's Salamander - but I won't hold it against him, because his axie's are the happiest I've ever seen in a shop.

My friends don't get my obsession with my axies or think that they are beautiful - but on the internet, there are people (you lot!) who understand. I'm not saying we have to all accept and love each others differences because of the shared interest, more that you mustn't get stroppy when you don't get the mollycoddling answer you hoped for. Someone cared enough to reach out and help you.

Oh... And one last thing...

....if we have to put up with hundreds of posts about how cute an axolotl is and how it likes to play becuse "it´s a very special and clever little axie, you know, it likes being tickled", then by the gods, when anybody else tries to actually share valuable information, shut up and take it or just don´t read it, but DO NOT have the gigantic balls to tell them that what they are posting doesn´t belong or is not relevant.


Argh....that felt nice

Azhael ... FYI... My Axie loves being ticked and is very clever in the same way that my friends chihuahua just LOVES to be dressed up in festive outfits (yeah, right) or my bosses kid is THE smartest and most advanced child in the world (sure...) ... I don't have children or cats or big lovable dogs... I have a fat little axolotl that my friends think is ugly but people on the internet indulge my cooing. Don't shoot me down because I reached out to other people that don't think it's wrong to mollycoddle a caudate

So yeah... As the good man says... Take care of eachother. And yourselves!

*Runs and hides*

 

[KrisztianNemeth]

On this forum everyone i have talked to has been lovely and very helpful but i must admit on other forums people can be rather snappy! Maybe this is just their personality but it comes across as rude sometimes. Also about being so serious I have got to say that to me keeping caudata is slightly ( VERY ) addictive, this month alone i have spent £200 on different salamandra subspecies! (All saved up from saturdays working in a take-away I asure you I am not spoilt...)

 

[dennis]

I love all my animals just the same. A bunch.It is an amazing privilege for me to share sometime in this life with them. And I confess the older I get, the more passionate I become for their defense be it a couple dollar spiderling or a thousand dollar plus gila monster. All worth more than money to me. I've had a lot a pets, you name it, from two years old on non stop.
I'm not quite forty but so much has changed in the world in my life time. I have seen a lot these animals homes disappear and the animals themselves. That saddens and really concerns me. I don't wanna ever be responsible for a species survival in only captivity, but more n more it is an ugly reality or at least possibility. For me personally I look at a caudate and I see a distant cousin. Not really just an organism trapped in glass. More so me millions a years back on the primordial path. I think that is really neat and the main reason I have always especially liked caudates and lizards......well I dig frogs, snakes and especially turtles plenty. But caudates n lizards are some my favorite life forms besides my dogs......but then again that is sorta hard to choose. All life is amazing. Live it!~

Peace

 

[Blackbun]

The key thing to remember is this:

This is not a saltwater reef forum. People here posting in the "help" section have not spent close to a grand on their new pets, therefore it is imparative that we showcase the inportence of providing the no holds barred care that newts require, even if they were only 5 bucks to begin with.

My goodness how times have changed. Have you seen the cost of fire salamanders these days?

 

[sde]

My goodness how times have changed. Have you seen the cost of fire salamanders these days?

Its funny you say that, i'm always telling my friend from the UK how lucky he is to get newts for practically nothing!
But yeah, i have noticed some of the rarer Salamandra do go for a decent amount.