Update on my axolotls

Stocking levels are always highly dependent on filtration and water change schedule, not so much as the actual tank size. Filtration does not compensate for water changes. Filtration simply traps physical debris and takes chemical waste (ammonia) through part of the nitrogen cycle to make it nitrate. From their it is your duty to keep things clean. You can have all the filtration in the world, if you don't do water changes they will suffer. So yes, this would be a better setup if it was a larger tank if I was not able to keep up the water change schedule.

The snails seem to be doing quite well and growing accordingly. I keep looking at them next to an axolotl and so far it looks fine. So in this case it seems they are big enough to not be an issue, but axolotls can be determined so don't flirt with the line between big enough and maybe not quite big enough.

Cohabitation is an important issue and needs to be chosen carefully. However, if we never put two things together that have any tiny risk of doing harm we would have to keep them all separate. In my opinion there are many cases where the risks of problems are too small to consider it a rule not to keep the two together. Any time you have animals together you need to be able to watch them carefully and recognize when problems may be arising.
 
The stocking levels (number and size of animals) in a tank are not only dependent of filtration and/or water changes. You will always have to consider some kind of crowding effect - too many animals will always stress each other, no matter what your water parameters are.

The snail on the photograph linked by Jennewt also did fine with the axolotls - at least until one of them tried to swallow this snail. In this case the snail was removed fast enough with a tweezer but there could have been an outcome far worse if the keeper of the axolotl would have seen it too late.
To me that is the same case as with the mixing of gold fish and axolotls - there is always a "so far everything seems fine!" until something goes wrong. And therefore I would not need to test any (unnatural) cohabitation and yes - I do keep axolotls seperate in a one-species-tank even if it might be a tiny risk.
 
I was not suggesting that stocking is independent of tank size or that you can ignore tank size if you do enough water changes, just that stocking is not based only on tank size. This tank is at the upper limit of stocking, but not overstocked. The goldfish have room. The axolotls have room. They all have enough room, for now. As they grow, yes, they will need a bigger tank. But for now they are fine.

I see no evidence that this setup is not going to continue working. The goldfish are far too big for the axolotls to eat. The goldfish avoid the axolotls. The snails are too big to be eaten by the axolotls (not just 'hasn't happened yet', TOO BIG). And they all get along very well

Do you keep Axolotls individually?
 
I agree with Jenn. Any tank that needs an 80% weekly water change to maintain nitrates at 20ppm (which is not great) is a danger. All it would take is one bout of the flu and this tank will become very unstable. Goldfish are very messy and produce tons of waste. It looks like you have five in there and that they are not fully grown (could just be the pic). 5 goldies in a 40 is more than I would do (long term) without advanced and very efficient filtration like a wet/dry system or oversized canisters x 2. Adding the axies makes it even more of a gamble. I won't mention the species mixing because I am a habitual mixer myself (within limits).
 
Reptileguy2727 said:
Do you keep Axolotls individually?
Click to expand...

Just to answer this question (I think there is no point in "discussing" the mixing and stocking topic any further - you got your opinion, I got mine - and they definitely are different):
Yes, I keep axolotls in separate tanks. I do keep them in groups from 3 to 7 (depending on tank size) in 6 different tanks for quite some years now. The only animals I mix them with are sweet water shrimps, bloodworms and gammarus (as a snack) now and then.
 
And axolotls have never harmed eachother, even at similar sizes?

Some have somewhere, but it isn't that likely and you haven't had any major issues I'm assuming.

The water quality is great. The animals are doing great. They won't be in there forever.

They look good though.
 
I do frequently go two or three weeks without water changes without any issue. I try not to, but when I get busy with school sometimes it waits longer than I want it to. However if I do only do a few water changes in a week, this tank definitely gets one.
 
Would you be willing to do ammonia, nitrite and nitrate readings both before and after water changes? I'm really interested on seeing those. What's the temperature on that tank?

Is the tank water really that yellow color? Do you know why? Is it because of tannins from wood or some other source?

This is not the healthiest tank design. That is a lot of animals for comparatively little water as many sources would state your goldfish are overstocked and you have axies, snails, platies and guppies on to of them. It would take relatively little to throw this system horribly out of balance and possibly cause the death of all your livestock.

I know I won't change your mind but I feel this should have warning signs all over it.
 
I will try next time to get nitrate tests. The tank is cycled so ammonia and nitrites are 0.

It is not near as yellow as the pics make it look. It has a slight discoloration to it before a water change, but even then it is only noticeable after the water change when it is crystal clear.

The tank is overstocked in the classis 'rule' terms. And it is not their permanent setup. The guppies and platies have practically no bioload, and snails aren't exactly known for their bioload either. So it is not really much after the axolotls and goldfish.

Do not simulate this tank, at least not in stocking terms. This combination has worked for me and may for others under the right scirumstances, but this tank was not shared as a 'look what I can do! and you can too!'.
 
I don't know what bio load is!

I'm not familiar with bio load ( still coping with cycling!!) , but if it means what waste is produced then I am even more confused than usual. I have recently purchased 7 guppies which are in their own tank for becoming future live food for my axolotl , after they have finished their quarantine. I have so far spotted 11 fry. Despite having a filter I am needing to remove their waste at least 3 times a day, I am actually quite shocked just how much these little fish produce even to the extent that i am now not sure I even want to give them to the axolotl as food...knowing my luck they'll end up living in harmony and I'll be over run with their young.
I actually liked the picture that you posted and like most where suprised to see the range of species that you have together looking so well..but I thought from reading the posts that this is not a long term set up..and it was more about how they actually all looked together as a one off?
 
"So it is not really much after the axolotls and goldfish."

Sorry to go on, but goldfish are probably THE most polluting fish you can get, you really do need to get them out of that tank, maybe rehome them if you can't get another tank. To be very honest with you, they really look in a very poor condition. I implore you as a lover and keeper of fish and axies to reconsider :(
 
How do the goldfish not in poor condition? These goldfish are in great condition. They are all doing very well and growing at a healthy rate.

They will all be moving into a bigger home within a few months, maybe together, maybe not, it depends on what I end up moving them into. Guppies put off little waste and you should not need to be cleaning up after them if you have adequate filtration. Almost all of the bioload in this tank is the axolotls and the goldfish.

Here is the only other picture I have them, it doesn't show them all, but it does give a nice view of the two butterfly telescope-eyed goldfish.
goldfishin40above.jpg
 
Its great to see such a robust discussion has developed over this topic.

It occurs to me that Reptileguy is going to keep doing what he is doing because it is working for him. I hope for the sake of his complete stock that it does. He is not the only axie keeper to keep fish in with his axies successfully.

If it all turns to custard He knows there is a huge collective pool of knowledge here to help.

Lets remember this is the axolotl part of the site.

On that note reptileguy, how are your axies.
 
Doing well. They look much better than the ones at the National Aquarium in D.C., as do most I see on this site.

I can't wait to get them and the goldfish in a bigger setup. It is only a matter of whether it will be in a plastic heavy duty pre-formed pond or a large tank from glasscages.com.
 
After well over a week without a water change nitrates were 20ppm after sitting 17 minutes (it was supposed to sit for 5 minutes, then check the color, but I lost track of time).

Nonetheless I thought they would all look much better in a bigger tank, so I re-arranged all my tanks and got them into the 75. I just started a new thread to share so I guess we can go over there for any comments. Thank you all for your input.
 
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