How feeding Echinotriton andersoni.

[freves]

I hope that you do not think that we are forming a witchhunt against you Everyone is concerned because E. andersoni is a rare and somewhat delicate species in captivity, especially in the hands of someone less experienced with salamanders. I truly hope that they pull through but as has already been made clear the situation looks bad. If it helps to put things in perspective I have been keeping this species for about five years. During that time I have had perfectly healthy appearing individuals just suddenly die (thank goodness this has been a rare occurence). On a similar note last summer I handpicked a group of cf kweichowensis out of a Florida dealers stock. I immediately changed the soiled substrate in their deli cups and cooled them down for the trip home. I took every quarantine precaution learned in my eight years of keeping Tylototriton. The worst looking one in the group looked much, much better than your andersoni and they all still died. If I were you I would seriously consider taking this case to a BOI because this dealer f***** you over royally.
Chip

 

[Azhael]

If I were you I would seriously consider taking this case to a BOI because this dealer f***** you over royally.

I don´t mean to be inflammatory, but i think it´s worth pointing out that this case is, by no means, unique.

 

[TylototritonGuy]

Yeah like Rodrigo said, this case isnt rare, it happens a lot where someone buys something and the pet shop owner/seller doesnt care who the animal gets sold too :/

We aren't trying to make you feel bad or anything at all mate, I actually feel upset for you in all honesty :/ and Angry that this has happened to something as Rare and Endangered as this species!! :/

Also i have only just noticed this, why on earth are the posts appearing immediately!? lol They were processed first before they appeared! :/

 

[Azhael]

What you say is of course sadly correct, but i specifically meant it´s not a unique case when it comes to dealing with Dartfrog.

 

[TylototritonGuy]

What you say is of course sadly correct, but i specifically meant it´s not a unique case when it comes to dealing with Dartfrog.

Is their reputation that bad then?? :/ See i havent dealt with them before appart from the endless times i have tried to contact them...

 

[peter5930]

Here's the pic that was used in the ad for them:

 

[TylototritonGuy]

Here's the pic that was used in the ad for them:

Its got to be a different specimen, Dartfrog have only had these 2 for less than a month before this user bought them! Unless they are seriously full of internal parasites or have a disease, there is no way they would get that thin/emaciated surely? Personally, I think the individuals have not eaten a thing since DF have had them or they have been like this before DF got them...

I think, that this photo was taken either a long time ago or maybe taken off the internet but either way these are no way CB animals...

 

[Azhael]

Is their reputation that bad then?? :/ See i havent dealt with them before appart from the endless times i have tried to contact them...

This is probably not the place for extended critiques (we have a testimonials section), plus not everything is black or white, but you can find past commentaries about this shop using the search function.

 

[zerono10]

回复: How feeding Echinotriton andersoni.

they better now，they ate some Earthworms this morning。

 

[Azhael]

I´m glad to hear that. Try waxworms too, they are almost irresistible to caudates and they are rich in fat so they´ll help replenish their reserves.

 

[zerono10]

回复: How feeding Echinotriton andersoni.

how many worm i should feed every day？

 

[Jennewt]

Re: 回复: How feeding Echinotriton andersoni.

Start with small amounts daily (like one bite of food). If they are starved, giving them too much food all at once can kill them.

After a week, gradually increase the amount until they are eating as much as they will accept. It's impossible to say exactly how much that will be.

I agree with the other opinions here: these look like wild-caught animals, based on the photos in the first post.

 

[freves]

I would even go as far to say that you should offer food only every other day at this point. I am actually very surprised that they are even eating at all so perhaps there may be some hope. Jen's advice is sound. If they continue to eat it is going to be VERY tempting to want to feed them frequently. Refeeding syndrome can easily wipe them out so do not offer too much at first. I once lost a whole group of taliangensis to refeeding syndrome (and again they all looked much better than your andersoni). At the risk of beating a dead horse I hope that you realize how very rare this species is in captivity. Initially I was not even going to bother recommending that you seek treatment from a good herp qualified vet because I really did not think that they would even eat. Since they are accepting food however I would strongly suggest this.
Chip

 

[TylototritonGuy]

At the risk of beating a dead horse I hope that you realize how very rare this species is in captivity.

No really? :O .......... Sorry that's me being sarcastic because we have already said how rare it is lol and as for the user/owner of the Echinotriton, they clearly know how rare they are considering one of the first things they asked was "how to get them too breed?"...

But as to what else you said, your right in all fairness feeding that often might prove to be less helpful :/ Feeding anything too much food after starving could be the end of them... Personally at the risk of sounding out of order, I don't think you should have those animals at all, If you seriously need to ask how often to feed an animal (especially one as Endangered as this) then you clearly either have got no experience or even bothered to do any research before purchasing them :/ This is a highly specialised species and it seems to me that you have just jumped into it for either two reasons, the Breeding and the Status :/

 

[Kaysie]

No really? :O .......... Sorry that's me being sarcastic because we have already said how rare it is lol and as for the user/owner of the Echinotriton, they clearly know how rare they are considering one of the first things they asked was "how to get them too breed?"...

That's not true in the least; I can't tell you how many people come on here with any number of species (common and rare) and want to breed them before knowing anything about them.

 

[TylototritonGuy]

That's not true in the least; I can't tell you how many people come on here with any number of species (common and rare) and want to breed them before knowing anything about them.

In this case I highly disagree, I take it you haven't seen what was written on the advert then?

The seller quoted it as "[SIZE=-1]Increasingly threatened species from the Japanese Ryuku archipelago. These are the result of several successful captive breedings in Germany of specimens from Tokunoshima. Rarely, if ever offered in the UK. Very limited. We think these are a sexed pair and they are unrelated F1's."

Clearly the buyer saw this, while purchasing the specimens because, not being funny, who could miss such a strongly written advert and not look twice?? lol
I have highlighted all the main selling points that would appeal to a new comer to the Hobby, The advert sates 4 times how Rare they are, they then go to carry on saying Sexed Pair (appeals because the sound of it makes a new comer think its "easy to breed then") and finally it carries on to say Unrelated.

I do agree that some people ask how to breed alsorts straight away but seriously, are you thinking that they are breeding them just fun for fun?? If this was a common species i would understand the breeding side of it, but these are species classified as Endangered in Japan and Regionally Extinct in Taiwan and are rarely sold in captivity not something seen everyday, especially in the UK.
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[TylototritonGuy]

[SIZE=-1]
Forgive me if you take my post the wrong way, its not intended to at all. I just dont like people buying something they haven't bothered to research prior to arrival and having to ask how often to feed it and even the environment requirements is no sign that they are really interested...[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]If this was interest, Why wasn't these questions asked at moment of purchase?
Whenever I buy an animal I make sure that I know the animals requirements before I hand over the cash (Also make sure what I'm buying is healthy) if this be over Email, Phone or in person. I don't wait till they arrive or day after they arrive, to join a forum and ask question like those asked, If you dont know the Habitat requirements they what was the person keeping them in while they didn't have a answer? lol
[/SIZE]

 

[Coastal Groovin]

You should have sent them back. You should never buy from them again.

 

[mr cyclone]

Hi Foster Reeves. I know you have a lot of experience with these animals and Tylototriton ,can you post us any pictures of your Echinotrton and Tylototriton setup's and maybe some of your animals also so us humble keepers can see what they look like or are housed in?
I also double looked at the advert for them when they were advertised but i didn't know anything of their requirements

 

[freves]

I do not have to work tomorrow so I will try to get some pics tonight. I really do not mess with the camera enough to make it a smooth process. It is too bad that you are not in the US or else I would just text some to you...I am comfortable with that