Question: Cycle dosent seem to be progressing.

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Lachlan McKillo

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Hello, I've kept axolotls for around 15 years now, getting my first ones 15 years ago they had children which I raised from egg. I now have only the 3 children who are 11 year olds. I recently made a long trip move, and the biological filter sadly did not survive the journey, so I have been going through the cycle proccess again (im rusty since its been many years since my first tank was established) but I do understand the cycle mechanisms. I'll give a history of what has happened so far.

The media was transported in an open esky and kept wet, it went foul after the first day. I kept it wet in hope some bacteria may survive, it was like this for around 6 days.
The tank was setup on the 17th of July.
18th of July I detected ammonia, so I bought a quick start kit. This really didnt appear to do anything.
I continued to do 15% water changes daily, to every second day to keep ammonia low and have paid close attention to the axolotls behaviour looking for curved tails, engorged blood vessels, changing feeding habits just trying to identify any stress early. And have removed any excess waste and food. Ammonia has never gone above 0.50ppm.
On approximately the 2nd of August I went to the pet store and they kindly gave me filter media to help seed it as I was getting concerned no change had happened by this point.
26 days in as of this post date 12/08/2023 and no nitrite or nitrates detected.
I use water ager for all water being added to the tank mixed in a bucket.

I just wanted a bit of guidance on what to do, was it wrong to keep the media wet with no food? have I seeded it with other bacteria and blocked the good bacteria forming? Is it normal to still see no nitrite after 26 days?
Thank you so much!
 
because you've changed locations have you checked the tap waters chemistry ie.. ph etc.. ph can effect the nitrification process as has changes in minerals in water.
depending on the filtration nitrites sometimes aren't noticed, both nitrobacters and nitrosomonas reside in the filtration which means that the nitrobacters can consume/convert the nitrites into nitrates at the same rate as the nitrosomonas consume/convert ammonia into nitrites.
if the ammonia is reducing then some nitrification is happening.
if the bacteria in the filtration was dead then it would have been better to use either new media or thoroughly cleaned the old media to make it easier for the bacteria to re-colonise the filter.
pond sludge remover might prove useful to use as the enzymes will help remove dead bacteria and the fresh bacteria will help recolonise.
 
Thank you for your response Wolfen!
Water comes out of the tap at pH 6.8, in the tank it is 6.0 pH or lower (yellow) I believe it is normal for it to drop over a cycle.
Yeah I'm not sure if ammonia is reducing via nitrification or just through water changes.
If there were nitrites being produced wouldnt I expect a nitrate reading?
Would the sludge remover affect the cycle?
Cheers!
 
if your ph is 6 that would be you problem, at low ph most ammonia is in the form of ammonium which is very difficult for bacteria to consume/convert.
sludge remover is used mostly to help breakdown debris at the bottom of ponds, because this debris then adds to the bio-load most sludge removers also contain bacteria which help the biological filtration.
 
ideal ph for axolotls is 7.4-7.6, do you know what ph kh gh your axolotls are used too?
 
use bicarbonate of soda to increase ph and kh, if possible test gh, if gh is also low then a mineral solution may be required.
 
Just an update.
New house has 6.8 pH out of the tap and the water is soft, I used bicarbonate to raise the pH around 10 day ago 18/08/2023 which has the pH at a stable 7.6 (normal ph test) 7.4 (high pH test). Hardness is about middle ground 3-4 drops on both GH and KH, they also seems stable. Ammonia is still present sitting between 0.50 - 1.00ppm, nitites and nitrates are nill. So seemingly little progress on the cycle but the conditions are better. The axolotls dont seem stressed, still eating and looking normal. I've also run through API stress zyme+ closest thing to a sludge remover I could find, that was done around 5 days ago 23/08/2023.
I have had to do a complete water change to move the tank, I kept the filter full the enitre time and there was about a 3-4 hour gap between pack up and set up, unsure if that could have reset the whole process. I've since had to do another complete water change which the filter was full and inactive for around 1 hour.

Any tips on what to do next? do I need to get ammonia up to a certain ppm or is it better just to keep it lower (0.5-1.00ppm)?
Thanks!
 
your kh is near low for ideal 3-8 being ideal (keep an eye on it, low kh can cause ph to drop), your gh is very low 7-14 being ideal.
if the tank was fully emptied then refilled the water would need to settle for an hour or so, this is because even when a dechlorinator is used it take time for all the chlorine to be removed (otherwise any remaining chlorine will kill the filtration)
see if you can get any pond filter start or any pond bacteria (pond bacteria is like tropical/warm water bacteria but the bacteria is more suited for colder water, plus it's cheaper) bare in mind stress zyme+ is for warm water so will recolonise slower.
if your air stones are clogged clean/replace (biofiltration requires oxygen).
if you are using the same filtration system as before then the filtration has been proven to be able to handle the waste levels and just needs kick starting, providing your axolotls aren't in the tank adding ammonium chloride at 2-4ppm daily will start it (once it can remove all ammonia/nitrites it is ready), otherwise change water weekly or if ammonia exceeds 1.5ppm (limit of safe) change no more than 50% (dechlorinate first).
a lot of this you probably already know already.
get a tub, fill with tap water, dechlorinate then test for ammonia (this will test for chloromines and will see if some of the ammonia is from tap)
look into solutions like holtfreters for improving kh gh, info here.. Axolotls - Requirements & Water Conditions in Captivity
provided the tank ticks all the boxes the nitrogen cycle should start, ie.. aged water (no chlorine), good ph ie.. 7.4-7.6 (lower the ph the harder it is to break down ammonium/ammonia), plenty of oxygen in the water (filter bacteria is aerobic), no contaminants/pollutants (may be a good idea to use a chemical filter just in case ie.. activated carbon), plenty of bio-media for colonisation, water above 10°c (warmer water in cycling empty tank ie.. 20°c +), food for bacteria ie.. waste/ammonia etc.., bottled bacteria as top up, there are mixed opinions concerning salt/mineral levels and bacteria growth so might be an idea to sort gh level.
 
Good news! nitrite is finally present detected at 0.25ppm this morning nitrates are also present approximately 2ppm on the liquid test, it wasnt quite yellow but not as orange as the 5ppm marker. Ammonia is still present about 0.5ppm, expecting this to drop on its own as the bacteria multiply. Also bringing GH up slowly as well and I put an airstone in the tank.
Again thank you so much for your advice, I wanted to ask further advice on what the maximum level I should allow the nitrites to get to?
Thanks again!
 
whilst a tank cycles the nitrates can get up to 110ppm before a water change is required, 110ppm is also the maximum tolerant levels for axolotls (although for it to get get to such high levels the maintenance would be either poor or the tank to small for the inhabitants) as a side note ideal would be 0ppm-10ppm (although realistically 10ppm-20ppm due to zero normally being a sign of having problems with the cycle).
 
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