Worst tank ever!!! Help!

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Nattles88

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OK, it has taken me 3 weeks for my bloody test kit to arrive.

pH in 7.5
nitrate 5.0
ammonia between 2 and 4
nitrite 1.0

I feel like the worst owner EVER! My fish are still eating and swimming around happily though and Im siphoning the poop out everyday. Ive had the tank set up since before xmas. So whats wrong with my 'biological cycle' as they call it. What can I do to fix it? Do i need to take my axies out straight away?
 
Hi Nattles,

If those readings are accurate, i would be very alarmed. They are definitely on the high and dangerous end.

Just a few questions to try troubleshoot.

1 - Do you use a solution type test kit?

2 - Did you follow the instructions to add X number of drops etc. (I worry you may have added too much colour solution and got false positives)

3 - Did you try testing your tap water direct from the tap?

4 - Do you use a good dechlorinator before you use the water from the tap?

5 - Did you use the dechlorinator in right amounts?

6 - Do you scrub your tank for all its surfaces to remove the slimey layer?

7 - Do you perform 20% water changes or you change a lot of water at a time?

8 Do you use live plants?

Sorry to ask so much questions but im trying to figure out why your tank hasn't cycled yet.

Cheers
 
1. I am using the freshwater master test kit
2. I followed all the directions. i should test again just to make sure?
3. I havent but I will now that you mention it. My tapwater goes through a benchtop filter
4. I use the API water conditioner with the aloe vera mentioned on the housing page
5. Pretty sure I used he right amount? Could I have used too much or too little?
6. I havent scrubed the tank since I added water. Doesnt seem to be slimey but I'll check that too
7. I lose water from the tank when Im siphoning out the poop, then I top it up evey week with the conditioned water
8. I have just one live plant

another thing, on the weekend when I was doing the water topup, I noticed a decoration had little black spots over it. Came off with a light scrubbing with a clean toothbrush. Wha could that be?
 
Hi nattles,

Firstly don't panic. We will help you through this.

Yes it would be a good idea to repeat the test by following the instuctions carefully. Also do test the tap water source because some places add chloramines into the water. Presence of unneutralised chlorines and chloramines (perhaps due to too little dechlorinator) can render the colonisation of beneficial bacteria more difficult and delay the cycling process.

Also check that your tank surfaces feel slimey. If they do, leave it there. Thats what we want. In fact i would recommend you dont scrub any surfaces at all.

So far what you are doing seems right. Perhaps it just needs a little longer to cycle. If you have axies in there, may be a good idea to move them elsewhere first, perhaps in the fridge if you have nowhere else and perform daily water changes.

Live plants can buffer ammonia and nitrite spikes, if you can manage to keep them alive.

As for the little black spots that could be anything from tank debris, algae and bacteria. If you have any more in there, perhaps you can take a photo?

Cheers
 
Darkmaverick said:
If you have axies in there, may be a good idea to move them elsewhere first, perhaps in the fridge if you have nowhere else and perform daily water changes.
Click to expand...

Just to clarify, I think Ray means to do daily water changes on the tubs in the fridge. I personally would not do any water changes on the tank right now if you can remove the axies. A nitrate reading of 5 indicates that the cycling process is well under way. Changing tank water at this point may slow down the cycling process. When your ammonia and nitrites come down, your nitrates will climb and your tank will be cycled. At that point you will need to slowly increase the bio load (axies, food, & waste) on the tank.
 
ok i tested my tapwater that i use from the filter
p.h 7.4
ammonia 0.25
nitrite 0
nitrate 0

Im just going to check axies tank again right now
 
tank water is

Ph 7.4
ammonia between 2 and 4
nitrite 1
nitrate 5.0
 
And I just figured out my tank is 54litres or 13.8gal and I have 2 axies in there that are just over 15cm long. They eat an awful lot so Im guessing all the poop from that will add to the ammonia.

okay i'll stop now
 
you don't want to wash the sponge too well... I pull mine out every couple weeks and give the foam a gentle squeeze in some excess tank water... just enough to ensure they don't get plugged up. For now, I would keep checking the water parameters daily and not mess with the tank too much. Are you sure about the ammonia readings? That seems to be a rather broad range.
 
the colour scale I have to measure it has one 'colour" for 2ppm and another one for 4ppm and i just cant figure out which one its closer to
 
Hi nattles,

I know this sounds wierd but do you think you can take a picture of the chemistry readings you have against the comparison colour chart?

Cheers
 
i sure can, i think I may have driven myself silly with trying to match these thingys so I may have just mucked them up
 
Hi Nattles,

Some random thoughts here. First - I so know what you mean about the color charts. They make me wonder if I have some new kind of color blindness (is it blue or green?). Second, you wrote that you have been cycling since before Christmas and I thought I'd console you that cycling can take months, so don't worry about that part.

Third, you mentioned a benchtop filter for your tap water. I don't really know what that is, but it made me wonder if it is a water softener? Back when I lived in the US, there were these water softeners you could attach to your tap underneat the sink. These came with the warning not to use the softened water to water plants, because the softener was a kind of salt that would kill the plants. I am wondering if maybe there is something like that going on with your benchtop filter? Just a thought because as you can see, there is a lot of guesswork in my thinking.

Good luck to you,

-Eva
 
G'day Nattles,

I am more inclined to think that your tank has completed the nitrification cycle, because you have traces of nitrate, while the tap water gives a negative reading for nitrate. It does, however, give a positive reading for ammonia, which more than likely means that the tap water has been treated with chloramine.

Chloramine is essentially ammonia bound to two chloride ions. When using a dechlorinator to neutralise chloramine, the net effect will be the binding of chloride ions to sodium thiosulphate (main chemical in the dechlorinator), with the subsequent release of ammonia into the tank. I think this is where you are having difficulties. The idea here would be to double the concentration/dose of the dechlorinator. Sodium thiosulphate is inert and harmless, so you don't need to worry about its chemical effects (within reason, of course)

NB. The slightest trace of ammonia in the tank will cause nitrite to appear again.

Also, I would purchase another dechlorinator. Aloe vera in a dechlorinator doesn't really have a purpose other than to add to the bioload, which is the last thing you need now. Generic dechlorinators that neutralise both chloramine and chlorine will suffice.

There is another "theory" that I'm kicking around in my head, but give this double concentration/dose method a chance, and hopefully the second idea won't be neccessary.

Best of luck to you! ;)

Jay.
 
Kal El said:
I am more inclined to think that your tank has completed the nitrification cycle, because you have traces of nitrate, while the tap water gives a negative reading for nitrate. It does, however, give a positive reading for ammonia, which more than likely means that the tap water has been treated with chloramine.
Click to expand...

Jay, I see what you're saying and I have a question... Fortunately, I am blessed with well water that doesn't have any chemical treatments so I'm not as familiar with the chlorine/chloramine effects.

Does Chloramine effect nitrite readings as well? I was always under the impression that they only effected ammonia readings. Nattles is reading 1 for nitrites so I assumed that the nitrification process is not complete yet unless the nitrite readings are effected by the chloramine as well.

Does chlorine alone give false ammonia readings or is it only the ammonia bound in the chloramine that effect the readings?
 
G'day Geosheets,

It is interesting that your tap water isn't treated with either chlorine or chloramine. Does this mean that your tap water is chemical-free? I'd imagine that it would go through some sort of filtration procedure.

As I mentioned in my original post, the general chloramine molecule consists of two chloride ions bonded to an ammonia (NH3) molecule. When you add dechlorinator to tap water treated with chloramine, the principle chemical (sodium thiosulphate,) in the dechlorinator will attach to the chloride ions. As a result, NH3 is released into the water. Depending on the pH, NH3 will remain in this form or it will readily accept a hydronium ion and be converted to the less toxic form, ammonium (NH4). Because Nattles has a pH of 7.4, NH3 will be the predominant molecule of the two.

The slightest presence of either NH3/NH4 in a established tank will be metabolised to nitrite by the nitrifying bacteria (general idiom, of course). So, yes, chloramine will affect the nitrite reading. However, its action is some what secondary, if you know what I mean.

Chlorine can give a false positive reading but only if you test the water straight after a water change, i.e. after adding dechlorinator. This is especially true if you get "trigger-happy" with the dechlorinator. Sodium thiosulphate requires at least 24 hours to react with the chloride in the water. If you test for ammonia straight after a water change, sodium thiosulphate will react with the chloride that is present in the ammonia test kit, thus giving you the false positive reading.

Hope this answered your questions :happy:

Jay.
 
Kal El said:
It is interesting that your tap water isn't treated with either chlorine or chloramine. Does this mean that your tap water is chemical-free? I'd imagine that it would go through some sort of filtration procedure.
Click to expand...

It is chemical free as it's from my own private well. I usually test it anyways before water changes to ensure that someone else hasn't treated their well and it's leached into mine... but, most the homes around me are on municipal water so, I've not had any issues. I treat the water in most of the house with a softener but also have one faucet inside(and 2 outside) that is straight from the well.

---George

P.S. Thanks for the other info.
 
Havent been able to take any photos yet. :( In reply to an earlier post I use this to treat my water http://aquariumpharm.com/Products/Product.aspx?ProductID=43 I belive this is the water condition that is recommended on the axolotl site, thats why i chose it.

My fiance went into town today to piick up more bloodworms for me and he came back with this http://aquariumpharm.com/Products/Product.aspx?ProductID=44 and this http://www.aquariumpharm.com/Products/Product.aspx?ProductID=45 he thought they might be helpful. Will these boost my cycle and cut down on the ammonia or is it just a quick fix and not really addressing the problem?
Hover and Smiley and still as happy as clams
 
Hi Nattles,

It really makes me glad whenever i see an axie owner really making the effort to research and provide the best for their axie.

I personally use the API stress zyme and stress coat for years without any problems (for both axies and aquarium fish). I guess it all boils down to personal preference. Some people feel that products that claim to contain live bacteria doesn't really do much to aid in tank cycling. Others feel that products that contain aloe vera doesn't do much as well and is there only as a marketing gimmick of sorts. However, these products are safe to use and is only through your own experience that you can evaluate if they are desirable products.

I would not use Ammo lock because i feel that regular water changes is the only way to maintain good water chemistry. Using chemicals is really only a very temporary measure that doesn't deal with the underlying condition (such as decomposing wastes/food/lack of water changes) and definitely not a replacement.

However that said, i believe if used correctly, ammo lock can come in useful in emergencies or in unforeseen circumstances. For example, if you are away on a month vacation and the only person who can help you to take care of the axies isn't able to perform water changes. I have to stress that i am not an advocate for the use of chemicals unncessarily though as it can be more detrimental than good.

Another product you might like to consider is "Prime". It comes in a red bottle and is really a quality product that a lot of experienced aquarists use.

Cheers
 
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