what fish can go with fire belly newts please

[tamz]

Hi there, i know alot of people dont like fish with newts, but i have a 4ft tank with seven fire belly newts, three adult female guppys, one male guppy and about 20 babys. (i will be removing alot of the babys in the near future).

I will be adding some neons too, but what i want to know is what kind of sucker fish can i add please? also is the small silver sharks with black tails ok? (i will try and get some pictures of what i mean). i know some fish dont get on with newts and there toxins, but i'v not found out much on the net about what fish will be ok.

can any one please give me the names of some fish that are ok with fire belly newts?
I dont want any think attacking the newts.

my tank temprature is normally at 22 degrees C, it can drop to about 20 min and the highest i allow it to go is 23 maximum, otherwise the newts will be to warm. i know alot of tropical fish like to be at 26-28 degrees C but iv tested my baby guppys in a smaller tank with the temprature at 26 degrees C and they are now back in the big tank at 22 degrees C. i have had no problems with any of my fish and i have had this set-up for a few months now

this is a picture of the shark i asked about above...

this is another one i want...

and another one....

thanks very much

Tamz x

 

[SludgeMunkey]

Has nothing to do with people "liking" fish with newts.

Newts eat fish.

Your pictured choices have very different water chemistry requirements.

Guppies are your best bet, and the newts will more than likely eat a few of them over time.

 

[Azhael]

You are missing many of the problematic points. Toxins and the possibility of predation are only two of the many reasons why mixing fish and caudates i very rarely a good idea.

Cynops orientalis are not designed for eating fish. A lot of different species actively inhabit fishless masses of water, forcing them to live with fish will stress them constantly.
Temps are a problem...you shouldn´t keep your newts at a constant 22ºC...very unhealthy for them. They need colder temps at least for some months a year...

If most of us don´t "like" mixing is because there´s plenty of reasons not to...but there is no real reason that warrants it.

 

[tamz]

Ah I see, thanks very much.
I have asked people about mixing fish and newts and the only reasons I had from people was because people don't like the idea of a community tank with newts.
No one has actually given me proper reasons before.
I spoke to some one before I set my tank up and he said I just had to be aware of the fact that I might loose the odd fish from a newt eating it, which I didn't really mind as it doesn't happen very often and the fish would be a little on the big side for the newts to eat.
I also thought having the newts at one set temperature was fine as long as it never hit 23 degrees C, what's the problem I could cause by keeping them at 22 please?

The three pictures above are three fish I like in my friends tropical aquarium so I've not done much research on them about their water temperature yet,I wanted to know if it could work with newts before spending hours doing that research

thanks very much guys
Tamz x

 

[Azhael]

It seems there are people out there who are very against the idea of mixing, and yet they don´t realy know why.
As you know now, there are many reasons why it´s a bad idea. There are some threads around the forum that deal with this matter. You can do a quick search and learn more about this if you want.

22ºC is ok for a newt as long as it´s not constant. The inmunological system of caudates apparently stops being efficient when they are exposed to high temps...which leaves them unprotected against infections, parasites, etc.
So, by keeping them at a constant 22ºC, you are putting pressure on their inmune systems. 22ºC it´s not too high, but it´s not ideal. They benefit from a winter period at colder temps (they survive and even enjoy temps as low as 4ºC), not only for triggering breeding behaviour, but also because it´s important for their annual methabolic and hormonal processes. That doesn´t mean your newts are inevitably going to die if kept at 22ºC...but remember..their inmune system it´s not at it´s best at that temp, and if a sudden heat wave made those temps rise...they´d be in good trouble.
Anything above 24ºC could be considered potentially fatal for many species.

 

[Jennewt]

For me, the biggest reason in favor of keeping fish and newts separated is temperature. To have a truly healthy newt long-term, they really thrive on a cold temperature during the winter months. And this just isn't possible in a mixed tank.

The only fish I keep with newts is the White Cloud Mountain Minnow. They are colorful and peaceful and too fast-moving to be eaten by the newts.

Also note that any fish having spines poses a threat to newts. There have been several unhappy incidents of this sort:
http://www.caudata.org/cc/articles/Mixing_disasters.shtml

 

[tamz]

Thanks for your answers, helping me a lot.
My tank often goes down to 19 degrees C and at the moment in Guernsey we are getting hot weather (when I say hot, I mean hot weather for over here) and my tank hasn't gone over 22 degrees C.
I have a heater, but its not been working under the setting of 25 degrees C so I've taken it out and hoping the water stays around 20 degrees.
If the water gets over 22 I use treated ice cubes by letting them drip in to the tank, but I've not needed to do that since I removed my heater.
If I do let the temperature do what it likes between 19-22 would that be enough of a change to help protect my newts and at the same time keep my guppyies alive?

Great help with that link too, thanks.

Thanks again
Tamz

 

[tamz]

I guess if I am going to keep fish with my newts, I'm probably best to go for some molly's, my guppies, neons and White Cloud Mountain Minnows?

There is one kind of fish I really would like to have and that is some kind of sucker fish, is that possible? I would only have one unless it was a type that would rather a mate.
if it is possible, does any one know which one would be the best to try please?

Thank you
Tamz x

 

[Abrahm]

I guess if I am going to keep fish with my newts, I'm probably best to go for some molly's, my guppies, neons and White Cloud Mountain Minnows?

There is one kind of fish I really would like to have and that is some kind of sucker fish, is that possible? I would only have one unless it was a type that would rather a mate.
if it is possible, does any one know which one would be the best to try please?

Thank you
Tamz x

Well, here's some tips on the specific fish you suggested. Of the ones you asked about the only ones I would consider are white cloud mountain minnows and guppies.

Mollies are a tropical fish and do best at temps that near 80F (27C) or a little over. At the temperatures your tank is currently at they will get the "shimmies" and probably die pretty quickly. Neon tetras also need higher temps, not as high as mollies. Neons also suffer from the fact that they are a schooling fish and to do well they need a large tank and a school of at least 5 fish, with 10 being better. They are a pretty touchy fish all things considered.

The two fish you had pictures of in your opening post (a bala shark, a redtail shark and a pictus catfish respectively) would make bad tank mates. Bala sharks are large schooling fish. They should be kept in groups and they need a large tank, preferably at least 120 gallons to flourish. Red tail sharks are territorial and will probably harass your newts. A pictus cat gets big, is extremely active and will likely try to gobble up your newts and possibly succeed.

Sucker fish are a family known as the Loriicaridae or armored catfish. They are exclusively tropical and most of them get huge! The common plecostomus can get to be 24 inches long. That's a huge fish and most of them wouldn't miss a chance to experiment with a newt. Of course temperature is also an issue and most of the smaller sucker fish would probably not last long at your temps. The only sucker fish I would recommend would be the Ancistrus sps. or bushy nose plecostomus. These have small size going for them but could possibly eat or injure a newt. These fish are not strictly algae eaters and can be opportunistic. One other possibility that I would strongly recommend against is the Otocinclus affinis. A very small 1-2" sucker fish that may tolerate your temperatures. It may be small enough to be ingested by a newt and it does have many defensive spikes that could end up killing both animals.

Hopefully that information helps!

 

[tamz]

yep it sure did, thank you i will also pass that information on to a friend of mine as she has only two bala sharks in her tank