Urgent Ommatotriton advice required!

[gp]

I have a group of 18 month oldish Ommatotriton that are currently growing and feeding well - except for the runt of the group. They are still being kept in a terrestrial set-up with a gradient from bone dry to moist with numerous hides spanning the whole moisture gradient.

The smallest of the group has developed an odd ailment that I am at a loss to explain and need any advice from anyone that's seen the condition before. The symptoms are as follows:

Seemingly dry eyes that are not open properly and poor motor skills with erratic and somewhat laboured movement that seems to imply somekind of nervous system problem.

In my initial attempts to remedy the situation I was spraying the newt lightly. This seemed to improve the problem with his eyes immediately and over the course of the the following few minutes its walking would improve dramatically but not return completely to normal. However, longterm the symptoms seem to persist and I have repeated this treatment only to find it the next day in the same state.

My only thought as to a cause of the illness is a vitamin/mineral difficiency, something that seems unlikely given the robust and healthy appearace of its cohorts. That being said it has always been the runt of the group. Its weight is also less than its cage mates, it is not yet deathly skinny but I'm sure if the condition continues it will end up that way.

The only other time I have seen anything like this was with a group of newly metamorphosed marbled newts that were subjected to low temperatures that they were unable to handle. They too showed the strange erratic and laboured movement. However, in this case temperature has not played a role.

Any help anyone can provide would be very much appreciated as I fear without immediate action things could take a turn for the wors!.

 

[Jennewt]

I have found that with my group, the larger ones tend to hog the food. The only way to remedy this has been to keep them sorted by size in separate enclosures. I would suggest moving the small one to a separate setup and determine if he is eating. In my group, I lost a few because they weren't eating well, and by the time I realized this it was too late.

 

[gp]

It's good advice Jen & I'll certainly undertake these measures. Although, the size difference between the newt in question and his nearest sibling is virtually non-existant (barring the obvious difference in weight). Also, there is an abundance of a variety of food. It certainly has opportunity to feed. I tried feeding him in isoltaion after moistening its eyes so they would open correctly. I could see it tracking the movement of the prey but it made no effort to stalk or strike, something this species usually seems to relish.

My feeling is that the underlying condition is preventing him from feeding and this inturn has lead to the weight loss.

Do you think that not feeding would lead to the strange movement and lack of control of limbs? Sometimes it drags its back legs and then it seems to regain partial control and then loses control of its front legs and pushes itself around. Very strange indeed. Also, the dry closed eyes are a real mystery to me, particularly as when artificially moistened they seem to return to normal. These symptoms seem neurological in nature.

Truthfully, I fear I may be fighting a losing battle. It's a real shame as this one seems to be one of the few females in the group. However, I will defiantly keep trying. Any further advice would be greatly appreciated.

Graeme

 

[gp]

As feared, the worst has happened. The little fella has expired despite all my best efforts!

It's been a real struggle getting it this far so I guess it's no real surprise.

I just hope the rest of this group and the group I'm raising from last year do not suffer the same fate. They all seem fit and healthy, so fingers crossed!

 

[Jennewt]

Sorry to hear it. This is a difficult species.

 

[Azhael]

Indeed it is....
I lost my entire group, and i had some that were almost sub-adult and growing spectacularly well.

 

[gp]

My worst fear has come true and this odd affliction is now spreading through the group. I found the largest and healthiest of the group on his back last night struggling to right himself. On closer insection he had lost a huge amount of weight since being fed on Saturday evening.

All the syptoms are the same plus a few new ones. His skin is sticky and upon my return this eveing he appears more-or-less paralyzed with legs stuck firmly to his sides. There also appears to be small white ulcerations in a couple of places.

The speed with which it has taken its toll is incredible. The previous individual took 3 weeks to decline from health. In this case it has progressed almost as far in 3 days!

I am considering fridging him in case its some kind of bacterial or viral infection but it seems like a really long shot at this stage. Even if this is the case it will not cure but I feel I have nothing to lose at this stage.

I am baffled by the range and combination of the symptoms and fear now this will take the whole group. Anybody with any ideas or suggestions please reply as soon as possible.

 

[Azhael]

So sorry to hear that :S
Sounds exactly like what happened to my group. My only guess for the problems i had with my group is that i failed to keep them dry enough...so maybe you´d want to check on that.
Other than that i can´t say...i wish i could help you but i failed misserably....

 

[gp]

Thanks for the quick reply.

So you recognise the specific symptoms or just the pattern of something like this spreading through a group of Ommatotriton?

I've just had a closer look to determine if there were any other obvious sources or symptoms. The paralysis seems almost complete. He also seems to be bleeding from a small lesion on his underside. I suspect this was sustained as a result of his paralysis by a nibbling woodlouse as there is nothing else in the enclosure with him!

A certain amount of condensation had accumulated over the weekend and seems to have dampened a small area of the 'dry' side but the enclosure is still overall 'dry'. I don't know - I'm utterly distraught. I was hoping the larger of the group would venture into the water this spring.

 

[Azhael]

I feel your pain, mate...i even lost a sub-adult male too...

The symptoms in mine were bloating, "wetness" of the skin which developed into sores and severe skin degradation, complete lack of appetite and different degrees of motor problems.
All this happened in 3-4 days...from perfectly healthy and eating great to dead....

I really hope you have much better luck than i did!

 

[froggy]

Is it worth quarantining the rest in separate enclosures, in case it is contagious and some are nt yet infected? I had the exact same problem with some Paramesotriton aff. fuzhongensis juveniles. The ailment struck regardless of how well animals were doing. Moving them to a more complex setup with very damp and very dry spots and lots of leaflitter, with a wider variety of food, seemed to help.

Sorry not to be able to help very myuch - I hope you can resolve the problem...

Chris

 

[gp]

I've separated them out and disposed of all substrate and hides have been disinfected etc. the new enclosures are even more on the dry side. I just hope they're not too dry!

If this whole problem has originated from moisture/humidity levels I will kick myself. Perhaps, several times. What a school boy error for the keeping of Ommatotriton! Although, honestly I'll probably never know for sure! My only ambition know is to keep the rest alive!

We'll see.

Thanks for everyones advice and support.