Tiger Salamander septicemia/fungus?

[cadaverine]

I'm having some trouble finding information on treatment for septicemia. I noticed yesterday that my Tiger salamander, Pudge, had black dots over his entire body. I'm assuming the dots are a fungus ~ they look like the black mold found in a shower. He took two small mealworms from me yesterday, but now refuses to eat. Today I noticed red areas on his underside, which would indicate septicemia.

Pudge's habitat is a 20 gal. long, with coconut fiber substrate, large water bowl, and a cave to hide in. There is no lighting hooked up, and the tank temp. is room temperature.

I placed him in a clean 10 gal. with damp paper towels and I've been spraying him with de-chlorinated water every so often ~ his skin appears to be wrinkling from dehydration. I tried a brief salt bath this morning, less than 1/2 teaspoon of salt to 4 cups of de-chlorinated water. How often can I do this?

This is completely my fault for neglecting to change his water sooner. I do not have a knowledgeable vet in my area. I would appreciate anyone's help in directing me to the information I need. I can also load a photograph if needed.

 

[flyangler18]

A photograph would be most helpful.

A few questions:
-How long have you had this tiger?
-What is your feeding regimen?
-What are you typically feeding?

 

[cadaverine]

It's too late in the day for me to get a good quality photo ~ will have to try tomorrow, but maybe this one is okay for now. He's clean - I realize it looks like there is substrate stuck to him.

I've had Pudge for about 3 or 4 years, and I usually feed him 1-2 times a week. Unfortunately, I haven't been varying his diet much ~ he usually subsides on small mealworms, which I only dust with vitamins occasionally. I hand feed him so that he doesn't ingest substrate.

 

[flyangler18]

I think your first order of business would be getting Pudge on a more 'complete' diet. Earthworms are near perfect food for caudates, and form the staple for my tigers and other Ambystomatids that I keep. The mealworms are inadequate as a staple for a couple of reasons: they are deficient in calcium: phosphorus ratio (which should be as close to 2:1 as possible) and the chitin contained in the exoskeletons can potentially pose impaction problems.

I'm unfamiliar with fungus showing up in that way, but quarantine in a more sterile set up is certainly warranted (as you have already done).

 

[sammy4tbts]

Hi C, are you having any luck with your tiger? Can you tell if the salt bath is helping? I wish I had some advice for you, but I just lost my 4 yr old tiger from unknown causes. He lost all of his color, but I couldn't see any thing that looked like fungus. I tried the salt bath.

Best of luck to you and Pudge.

 

[cadaverine]

I think your first order of business would be getting Pudge on a more 'complete' diet. Earthworms are near perfect food for caudates, and form the staple for my tigers and other Ambystomatids that I keep. The mealworms are inadequate as a staple for a couple of reasons: they are deficient in calcium: phosphorus ratio (which should be as close to 2:1 as possible) and the chitin contained in the exoskeletons can potentially pose impaction problems.

I'm unfamiliar with fungus showing up in that way, but quarantine in a more sterile set up is certainly warranted (as you have already done).

Thank you for your reply...and yes, I agree about the better diet. I tried feeding him a waxworm because I figured it would be easier to digest, but he's refusing it. This morning I noticed he passed the mealworms I fed him the other day ~ unfortunately, they weren't digested. It's upsetting because his stool has always been really great...

Since he isn't emaciated, I'm hoping that I don't need to force-feed him?

 

[cadaverine]

Hi C, are you having any luck with your tiger? Can you tell if the salt bath is helping? I wish I had some advice for you, but I just lost my 4 yr old tiger from unknown causes. He lost all of his color, but I couldn't see any thing that looked like fungus. I tried the salt bath.

Best of luck to you and Pudge.

The only positive change that I've observed is that his eyes aren't sunken ~ yet his eyelids are still puffy.

Not sure if the salt bath is helping, but how often should I be doing it? I figured that twice a day for no more than 10 minutes would be safe?

And thank you for your concern ~ I'm sorry to hear about your loss...

 

[sammy4tbts]

That's how I did the salt bath for my tiger. Did you get the instructions from the Caudata Culture page? If not, here's the link:

http://www.caudata.org/cc/

My tiger must have been sick without showing signs until it was too late. He was acting/eating normally, then burrowed under for a couple of days. When he emerged, he was a dark brown color all over, kinda wrinkly, wouldn't eat and was lethargic. No one here seemed to recognize his symptoms. I tried the salt bath. I felt totally helpless. He was dead within a few days. I hope it wasn't my fault. I'd found him in the road when he was tiny and he seemed to be thriving for almost four years. sigh.

It doesn't sound good that Pudge's worms weren't digested, but I'm surely no expert. The improvement in his eyes does sound good, though.

Thanks for the condolences. I hope you have better luck.

Its dogs and cats for me from now on; I know much more about how to care for them.

 

[Jennewt]

I wouldn't try force-feeding just yet. He can go for a couple of weeks without food before you need to worry.

I just remembered this thread, which may be relevant, and had a happy ending
http://www.caudata.org/forum/showthread.php?t=37216
I don't think the product mentioned is sold in the US, but there may be other fungal remedies that could be tried.

 

[cadaverine]

I wouldn't try force-feeding just yet. He can go for a couple of weeks without food before you need to worry.

I just remembered this thread, which may be relevant, and had a happy ending
http://www.caudata.org/forum/showthread.php?t=37216
I don't think the product mentioned is sold in the US, but there may be other fungal remedies that could be tried.

Hmm...Fungol seems to be a product sold for fish aquariums ~ I never would have thought of trying something like that. If I find a product that says it's safe for amphibians or at least invertebrates, would that be okay to use on a terrestrial salamander? It seems like the person in that other thread left their salamander in the treated water for several hours ~ I'm having trouble keeping Pudge in the salt water for just 10 minutes...

Thank you for linking that thread, it gives me a little hope.

 

[cadaverine]

Here are some more photos:

 

[Jennewt]

Fungol gives me pause because it contains malachite green, which is generally NOT recommended for caudates. But perhaps a short bath in it isn't enough to be toxic.

 

[cadaverine]

Fungol gives me pause because it contains malachite green, which is generally NOT recommended for caudates. But perhaps a short bath in it isn't enough to be toxic.

Are there any other harmful things besides malachite green I should be aware of?

 

[flyangler18]

I wonder if methylene blue would be equally effective (and safe for caudates).

 

[sammy4tbts]

cadaverine, I'm wondering how you & Pudge are doing. Haven't seen a post for a few days.

 

[cadaverine]

Sorry, he died the day after I took pics of him. In the morning, he seemed okay, but when I gave him his salt bath that evening, he was acting different ~ more lethargic...when I put him back in his cage I knew he wouldn't last through the night. The next morning he was in the same position I placed him in ~ with a damp paper towel over him...it looked like I tucked him in for the night. That day I was going to try and look for some aquatic medication to try...wish the idea would have come sooner.

Thanks for the support...

 

[Kaysie]

That's too bad. You did everything you could. It's often hard to diagnose and treat illnesses in caudates, as they don't display signs of illness until they're very sick. And often, illnesses present with general symptoms, and it's nearly impossible to do anything about it. But you did a good job, even though the outcome was poor. I hope this doesn't turn you off from keeping caudates.

 

[cadaverine]

That's too bad. You did everything you could. It's often hard to diagnose and treat illnesses in caudates, as they don't display signs of illness until they're very sick. And often, illnesses present with general symptoms, and it's nearly impossible to do anything about it. But you did a good job, even though the outcome was poor. I hope this doesn't turn you off from keeping caudates.

For now, I'm not planning on getting another salamander...I still have plenty of other pets that need attention [cats, dog, bird, skink, fish]. Recently, I've been feeling really bad about keeping pets in cages. If I *do* ever get another salamander, then at least I know to be more responsible. Thank you...

 

[starfunk]

Re: Tiger Salamander mold or tiger salamander spots

Hello
I recently rescued a cpl salamanders from a cpl young mean kids
they are a 2-3months old now n no longer aquatic
I feed worm meal n wax worms mist evet cpl days
I have had a slight mold but picked it out n they seem fine but recently they have been
Getting blue spots which obv could be tiger markings but I have fallen in love
With my lil dudes also how are my habitats
I cannot figure out how to upload from a cell sny help would be appreciated thx