The colour named "Copper"

[Xoxo]

Hi every one,

In Europe we have the colour named "copper" or "cake". Thise colour is very rare and we don't know the genetic.

I would like to know if these axolotls also are in other countries, and what you know about these axolotls.

We know that : This color is composed of shades of brown with dark brown spots, yellow and shiny copper, but no black. The axolotl is not very dark. It is not melanoid, or albino, nor Axanthic.

My hypothesis is that it is hypomelanism (h) and therefore the individual is homozygous for hypomelanic h (h / h). In all cases the experience of farmers show that copper is a recessive color.

In Germany some people think that the copper is more sensitive (mycosis, and healthproblem) but others don't. My two are in really good health. I think maybe some people did too much consanguinity. I want to undo that with my to healthy coppers (whose parents and greatparents are in good healthy too).

I have 2 of these "copper" axolotls and i can show you more pictures if you need

 

[zoezakella]

Not sure if we do but just wanted to say what a pretty axie love the colouring :happy:

 

[Xoxo]

Thank you :happy:

 

[ax]

Same here, what a wonderful axie :happy:

 

[Neil C]

Here in Australia (well at least around Brisbane) they are usually sold as "Olives". I have seen two different kinds with one a kind of olive colour and the other kind of pinky brown colour. The one shown below is definately an albino as she had white eggs and has a reddish eye. The olive ones are fairly common here but I've only seen the kind below once for sale and then they only two individuals.

Hope this helps and yes they are very beautiful animals.


Regards Neil

 

[Xoxo]

Thank you Neil !
Your informations are really interestings one !

Are you sure that the Olives ones aren't the wild ones ?
Have you other pictures or informations ?

Thank you so much for your help !

 

[Erzs]

That's a gorgeous coloured axolotl! It reminds me of a post from a few months back about some form of 'dalmatian' axolotl...or something. Maybe another forum user will remember it. I've never seen one around though.

 

[Morrison]

I'm still looking for a copper axie but they really are tough to find. I like the way they "run" through the tank sometimes.

 

[melfly]

It seems they are common in austrailia and in europe. Although I haven't heard of any in the UK as of yet.

Are they not just another strain of wild type??

@Neil if its albino why does it have pigment??

Mel

 

[callina]

Hi,

they don´t have black pigments, the melanophores. There is no black spot on the coppers skin, but only brown (light and dark).
My coppers and as I know all the others in Germany, too, will only lay white eggs. So, they must be albinos.
But no one knows the exact genetic of the coppers.

Tina

 

[HLFB]

Tyrosinase positive Albino?

Whatever it is, it looks great! The pet shop where I got my two Wild Types imported their animals from Europe and they kept telling me they were going to getting a shipment of colour varieties including a new one they referred to as "Steel" but couldn't remember what the name was for sure....I wonder if they meant Copper?

Mat.

 

[cichlidmayhem]

What pet shop was that Mat?

Gary

 

[HLFB]

Hey Gary,

The petshop was Menagerie in Cabbage town (Toronto, south east near Regent Park). I was speaking to the fish manager a few days ago and they have had to cancel their next order. They keep having their partners back out on the shipments and then their permits expire. They did confirm however that the new colour in question was in fact Copper and that they will have an order coming in within the next three months. They are just in the process of re-applying for permits and making the order. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pele5vptVgc

I'm there every couple of days usually so I'll let everyone know when and if they arrive. It'll be nice as Canadian exotic keepers to finally have something that makes the U.S. folks jealous and maybe gets them to throw a little cash our way for a change!

Mat.

 

[Neil C]

I took a few more pics today of the mother and I'll post a few pics of her three babies as soon as I have a bit of time.The babies hardly have any spotting at the moment but I hope this will change as they get older. The colour is a bit off true to life as they were taken under fluoro lights. In the last photo you can really see the red eyes of an albino. I also find it hard to understand how an albino (lacking pigment) can have so much colour? Hope you guys in Canada eventually get yours and anyone else out looking for them. I'll try and pick up an "Olive" next time I see one and post some pics.


Regards Neil

 

[Jennewt]

Have you guys compared yours to the so-called "silver dalmation" mutant in the US? At the risk of linking to this rather unpleasant thread, here is a link to the photos:
http://www.caudata.org/forum/f46-be...-free-all/71389-silver-dalmation-axolotl.html
Do you guys think it might be the same?

 

[HLFB]

Have you guys compared yours to the so-called "silver dalmation" mutant in the US? At the risk of linking to this rather unpleasant thread, here is a link to the photos:
http://www.caudata.org/forum/f46-be...-free-all/71389-silver-dalmation-axolotl.html
Do you guys think it might be the same?

That was unpleasant and bit disenchanting for a new member who came here trying to escape the back talk and backstabbery of the reptile world

Not the same at all. The colour is wrong and also Mr. Sommers' creations lack any pattern on the legs, whereas these are fully patterned. It also looks to me that Coppers have smallish regular spots while Mr. Sommers' animals (can we get a confirmed name of this mutation, cause it ain't "Silver Dalmatian") seem to have larger and darker spots.

Mat.

 

[Xoxo]

Neil nices photos ! Thank you

Mat, if your coppers are comming from Europe, you have to be aware of the problems some copper's family had in Germany.

I don't think that all the coppers in Germany are sick, but we have to breed them after observation and with safety. Yet my two coppers are in good health but I'm waiting 2 years to breed them, juste to be sure there are in good health, and to avoid replicate axolotls with problems. I'm doing it with caution.
I you want informations and details on the coppers from Europe, I can give them to you.

Do we know were are the others coppers from ?

 

[callina]

I you want informations and details on the coppers from Europe, I can give them to you.

Please can you give me these informations, too?
I know the problem of some german coppers.

 

[Xoxo]

Please can you give me these informations, too?
I know the problem of some german coppers.

Then you have all you need.
The most coppers from Europe are from Germany.
Some are from Austria but I'm searching information for theses.
The coppers from Switzerland are from Germany.

 

[oceanblue]

Like everyone else I can only speculate what "copper" is. The pigmentation is too dark to be the yellow colour of the xanthophores which is over expressed in (golden) albinos and is not the iridescent pigment either.

Could it be a mutant reddish melanin akin to the red hair variant of melanin in humans? If so copper is a highly appropriate name.

The white eggs indicates the mother does not produce ordinary melanin, it is important somehow in sorting out the basis of this colour but quite how it fits in I do not know.

It may be someone with interest in pigmentation could look at a skin biopsy, preferably with electron microscopy, to see if there is an unusual pattern of melanosomes in these animals. I do not know if the DNA of the appropriate genes has been sequenced and studied.