Tank water tests, first results

[Dakkagor]

I would like a bit of help interpreting these results, if that's all right.

Ammonia: high, about 6-8.0ppm

Nitrate (NO2) relatively low, 0.25-0.50ppm

Nitrate (N03) non existent to low, 0.00-5.0ppm

From what I've read elsewhere, and the way the tank is setup, I would draw the following conclusions. Am I right?

1: the bacteria colony isn't properly established yet (or the ammonia would be neutralised) so I need to do DAILY water changes to get it down. I have some water being de-chlorinated right now for the job, and plan to have a cycle of water being de-chlorinated to bring the level down.

2: the filter is doing its job admirably, and its keeping the nitrate low.

Is there anything else I can do to bring the ammonia down (add plants, for instance?) Should I move my axolotls to the fridge for the time being? (they don't seem stressed or unhappy in the water)

thanks for any advice guys. I'm pretty new to all this, so sorry for any obvious questions/mistakes.

 

[danchristopher]

An ammonia reading like that is easily enough to kill an axolotl so I am surprised they don't appear stressed, but perhaps you caught this ammonia spike early. When I initially cycled my tank it spiked much like yours is doing now, but I'm pretty sure the ammonia levels dropped completely by the time I had nitrate...? Someone might be able to shed more light on this. Can I ask what you're using to test the water? If you're using dipsticks they are known to be notoriously crappy. Cycling logic tells us ammonia should rise and then fall as nitrites rise and then they should fall while nitrate rises.

You are right, the bacterial colony is not yet established. How long has your tank been setup? You definitely need to be doing daily water changes with those readings if your axies are in the water. To be honest, I'd take them out. If you're getting nitrite/nitrate readings and are having a mass ammonia spike then it's probably only a matter of days before your tank cycles and will be ammonia free, and then you can place them back in there so there is ammonia (in the form of some fresh axie waste) present to feed your new bacterial colony.

It is actually not your filters job to keep your nitrate low. Beneficial bacteria colonises on the media in your filter and on the surfaces in your tank, there are two types of bacteria; one feeds off of ammonia and converts it into nitrite, the other feeds off of nitrite and converts it into nitrate. Plants feed off nitrate to some extent but generally it will build up in the water and will need to be removed by means of a water change.

Hope this all makes sense!

edit: I just realised you said this is your first test, so the most important question is how long has your tank been setup? It will take probably at least 4 week for your tank to cycle. If you're having ammonia readings that high then you definitely need to be doing water changes. You need to be trying to keep the ammonia down, definitely under 1ppm. This means a water change every day. If taking your axies out of the tank is an option then I would do it and cycle your tank by dropping some food in there to create ammonia and just waiting it out. It might be easier this way so you don't accidentally harm your axies and you can just keep them in a container or bucket and change the water daily.

 

[lollypop]

If you have your axies out of the tank and do 100% water changes you can put the waste water into the tank to keep the cycle in progress.

I would agree that the axies should be kept out of the tank while this is going on.
With out looking it up I think it's recommended to have 4ppm ammonia to get the cycles as quick as poss, so you change enough water out to have it at that. (without animals in tank) and when it drops below that, add more.

That might be a bit complicated (it's part of fish less cycling of a tank, using neat ammonia as a top up)

Not sure if this post has just confused things more.

 

[Dakkagor]

Thanks, I used an API freshwater test kit to generate the results. I think I've seen them recommended on the site.

I'm not sure on the Ammonia reading, because it was the first one I did and I may have added to much of the testing liquid and generated an erroneous result. I'll generate a new number in a minute and see what I get.

I may well move the Axoltols to the fridge in the living room if that's what's best. When I do that, should I use new water or stuff from the tank?

Edit: just did another ammonia test, it came up much closer to 4.0ppm, so I think I messed up the first test.

 

[lollypop]

To start with you want water the same temp as they are in now, so it cools with them in the fridge, and then declorinated water kept in the fridge with them so it's the same temp.

If you still have ammonia readings then I would go with new water, brought to there temp.

You have to make sure you do all the steps in the right order and timings right etc. but yeah I use api master test kit. It's good.

 

[Kaysie]

Filters don't remove nitrates; your bacteria just haven't generated nitrates yet. The only way to remove nitrates is through water changes.

 

[Dakkagor]

I'm setting up for fridging my guys now.

So, the plan is:

Get de-chlorinated water tubs set up in fridge. Move axolotls over.

Keep doing water changes for axolotls in tubs, using dirty water to speed tank cycle.

Leave tank as is, return axolotls when ammonia levels decrease.

Does that sound right to people?

 

[lollypop]

Sounds like a plan.

Don't forget. Test water every day, for ammonia, nitrate and nitrte, it's worth just jotting them down..

And letting the axies cool along with the water in the fridge.

 

[Ed]

Get de-chlorinated water tubs set up in fridge. Move axolotls over.

Keep doing water changes for axolotls in tubs, using dirty water to speed tank cycle.

Leave tank as is, return axolotls when ammonia levels decrease.

Does that sound right to people?

There are a couple of potential reasons you are seeing persistently high levels of ammonia.. the first is whether or not you are getting ammonia in from the water used for water changes (often as chloramine). Many of the dechlorinators will bind up the ammonia temporarily and then release it back into the water in a day or two.
The second could be due to high inputs of organics into the water (such as frozen foods like bloodworms).

Since you've removed the axolotls, you are correct in that you need to continue nutrient inputs to get the cycle to completion. I would suggest checking the water you are changing from the axolotls in the fridge since you are going to be significantly slowing down thier metabolism, it may not supply as much ammonia to keep the cycle moving along at the level you need (you can cycle the tank but the numbers of bacteria may be insufficient to handle the bioload when you put everyone back into the tank resulting in a second cycle).

Otherwise it sounds like you have a really good handle on what you need to do.

Ed

 

[Dakkagor]

There are a couple of potential reasons you are seeing persistently high levels of ammonia.. the first is whether or not you are getting ammonia in from the water used for water changes (often as chloramine). Many of the dechlorinators will bind up the ammonia temporarily and then release it back into the water in a day or two.
The second could be due to high inputs of organics into the water (such as frozen foods like bloodworms).

Since you've removed the axolotls, you are correct in that you need to continue nutrient inputs to get the cycle to completion. I would suggest checking the water you are changing from the axolotls in the fridge since you are going to be significantly slowing down thier metabolism, it may not supply as much ammonia to keep the cycle moving along at the level you need (you can cycle the tank but the numbers of bacteria may be insufficient to handle the bioload when you put everyone back into the tank resulting in a second cycle).

Otherwise it sounds like you have a really good handle on what you need to do.

Ed

thanks for the feedback Ed. I've checked with the water company, they are definitely using chlorine (and recommend the standard tricks for dechlorination for aquatics) so thats not it. however the frozen bloodworm that's forming their staple food source could be atleast part of the problem, the stuff is awfully messy.

thanks for all the help guys, I'll keep you posted.

 

[Dakkagor]

does anyone have any idea how long this whole cycle is going to take? Its been three days and the most recent results look like this:

Ammonia: 4.0
Nitrate 2: 2.0 (!)
Nitrate 3: 2.5 I think, the colour is inbetween. . .

The axies are safe in the fridge for the moment, but I would like to get them back into their tank as soon as possible.

 

[Kaysie]

Usually it takes a couple of weeks.

 

[Dakkagor]

****.

How long can they stay safely fridged for?

 

[Kaysie]

It depends on whether or not they're eating. If they're eating fine, practically indefinitely. If they're not eating, I wouldn't do it for longer than a week or so.

 

[Ed]

does anyone have any idea how long this whole cycle is going to take? Its been three days and the most recent results look like this:

Ammonia: 4.0
Nitrate 2: 2.0 (!)
Nitrate 3: 2.5 I think, the colour is inbetween. . .

The axies are safe in the fridge for the moment, but I would like to get them back into their tank as soon as possible.

A cycle in a totally new setup typically takes around 30 days or so but the shortest can be as fast as two weeks and if there are problems withe the tank or filter 60 days or more.

Make sure to wash the vials out completely before doing the next test, if not well washed out (include the caps..), and are used on a different test, you can get false results from the kit.

Ed

 

[Dakkagor]

Thanks for the responses. . .I tried to feed them today and they turned down food, so I won't keep them ion the fridge for longer than another 3 days, I will try again tomorrow and see if they are hungry then.

And two weeks. . .obviously I can keep the guys in a tub with constant water changes, out of the fridge, but that's beginning to strike me as difficult and stressful for them. Is there anything I can do to speed the cycle up?

Thanks for all the help so far guys!

 

[Chirple]

If there's somewhere/someone trustworthy you can get it from, you can seed a new aquarium with live matter from another.

My local pet store even sells live filters/media. I used a scoop of live sand to speed mine up. Sand doesn't have as much good bacteria as gravel - but the axolotls can't have gravel. I suppose you could do a large live rock or so that they couldn't swallow.

The plants that I got from established tanks helped as well.

Just make sure it's from a trusted source and transport it quickly/safely so the bacteria doesn't die. And let them know it's for a freshwater tank.

 

[Dakkagor]

Thanks, I'll check the local petstores and see what I can find!

 

[Kaysie]

I have to emphasize 'trustworthy'. If you do get live rock or plants some where, it can be harboring the bacteria you need, but it could also have things like snails, planaria, etc. It's a great idea, just make sure they're from a clean source.