Signs of a sick axie??

[Joy]

Hi, I've posted a couple times about my axie Scotti who seems to go off and on eating. He's 8 yrs old, water parameters: pH7.2, ammonia:0 Nitrate: 5 nitrite: 0
He goes up to 10 days without eating in the past 2months.
I've been looking on this site for an article on identifying symptoms of a sick axie. All I've picked up so far is the gills facing fwd and the tail I think curving fwd too?
He doesn't have any fungus or anything but he is getting thinner.
My new concern though is a few days ago, I had fed him some frozen baby turtle food b/c he seems to like it as opposed to always eating blood worms and he hates pellets.
The next morning I saw he vomited up the turtle food.

He's vomited a few times now. Is that something to be concerned about or do axies vomit occasionally?

Ok, then I saw him eat his vomit. I felt so bad for him but I was just about to fish it out in the morning when I saw it and then he ate it. I guess dogs do that too but is it a bad sign?

Then he had a long tarry looking poo that was about 2cm...super long, right? It was stuck to his bottom and it took a while for it separate from him and then there were 2 more poos in the next hour. That's completely not normal right? I've never seen that before.

Any suggestions? His gills aren't facing fwd and no real curving of the tail other than a bit of a ripple on the top end part of the tail. Thanks.

 

[Bellabelloo]

Something does seem to be bothering your little guy, if you have had him the last eight years you tend to know when something is amiss. Do you know what is in the frozen turtle food ?. It might be worth trying to offer him live earthworm, this is one of the best foods you can offer. Also has the tank been warmer than usual lately?
My axolotl will seem to go off food for longer periods of time than I am happy with , then they decide to start wanting food again.

 

[zoezakella]

Hi Joy,

Poor thing he's still not well then Luckily for you Julia has responded to you and she is the lady that helped me with my axie so your in safe hands now xxx

 

[Joy]

Hi, thanks for responding guys. The turtle food doesn't say on the package what it is other than "fortified w/ vitamins, minerals and fatty acids." That said, I rarely give him the turtle food. Just lately I have b/c he doesn't eat the blood worms right away or at all and it makes such a mess in the tank cleaning them up but the turtle food stays more intact and he can eat it a bit later. We're just coming out of winter here in Sydney so it hasn't been warm here at all until this week and this has been going on for 2 months now I think.
Is it always abnormal to vomit? And what about the weird looking poop? Sorry to be graphic but it looked awful and he must not feel well.
I'll try digging up an earthworm today but I think I should probably cut it into small pieces I assume b/c I don't think he could go for a normal size worm. I suppose I can keep frozen pieces of earthworm in the freezer to use when I want?
Thanks again

 

[kuphie]

Vomiting is never a good thing. Finding the cause of food aversion and vomiting can be frustrating. Do you thaw the frozen food all the way before feeding? I've heard this prevents frostbite in the G.I. Tract. I too would suggest feeding a live earthworm. feeding live food helps invoke a better feeding response.

RULE OUT:
If the water is too warm they can become stressed, causing inappetence, curled tail, sometimes cloudy patches on skin.
If the water is too cold. The metabolism slows down causing less need for food and sometimes regurgitation.
could he have eaten any small rocks lately that might be stuck in his G.I. Tract?

 

[Joy]

I didn't know I was supposed to thaw out the food. I've been feeding him frozen bloodworms for 8 yrs and in the past yr introduced frozen turtle food and it's been all good until lately when he's been seemingly weak and decreased appetite for the past 2 months with occasional vomiting and funny looking tarry excriment.
He often vomited in the past when I used to put the water conditioner in the bucket of new water for only a few minutes before filling the tank at a water change. But now I wait overnight with the new water to add to condition the new water better and I haven't seen him vomit with water changes since that.
I get onto digging for worms this week for sure.
I have the water at a good temp.
Do you think putting him in the fridge will help him at all convalesce or is it really just to remove impaction?
Also, when you talk about a curved tail, is it just the tip of the tail or is it the ridge of the tail that I'm looking at? He does have a rippled ridge lately but the tip of the tail looks ok.
Thanks a lot.

 

[sek]

It sounds like he may have eaten some gravel. Do you have a gravel substrate? Was he on one previously if you don't?

Best of luck

 

[kuphie]

I can't say if fridging is the right thing because i still don't know exactly whats going on. You say the water parameters are fine and the temp is "good"(what is it day to night, does it fluctuate?). When we talk about curled tail we mean the tip. Maybe show us some pictures of your tank and close-ups of your axolotl to show what you mean.

So you have had him for 8 yrs and when you got him 8 yrs ago he vomited 17 pebbles right? Maybe a pebble was in the g.i. tract for that long unnoticed, and just now starting problems while it's making it's way through.

Another Idea: maybe there's been a spike of minerals or metals in your water supply. Average water tests don't check for that, but i know my local fish shop can test for calcium and iron in the water. I hear axolotls can be sensitive to those kinds of minerals. You don't use crushed coral or plant fertilizers do you? Maybe try getting more detailed water tests at a local fish shop.

Last idea: Wasn't he full grown when you got him? Did they tell you the truth about his age? Maybe he has some internal metabolic issue from old age?

i wish i could help you better, but for the time being i have run out of ideas.

 

[Joy]

Hi, thanks for the ideas.
So, I got him only 1.5 yrs ago from my neighbors who had him for 7 years and they said they got him as a baby. So maybe he's older?? But a big thing is they were horrible to him and that's why I took him away. They didn't have a filter and changed the water only every 6 months and he only ate bloodworms for those 7 years. He was in a gravel tank and that was how he swallowed all the gravel.
Yes, he could have a residual stone. He passed out all those 17 stones within a wk of me taking out the gravel right away and has been seemingly healthy since.
It may be a metabolic/old age issue and I've thought of that but I like to think he'll still live till 15 years as I read they can live to in captivity. He's obviously a strong one to survive the treatment he got over there.
But now in the past 3 days he's eating daily or 2x/day and this is what has been happening. He'll stop eating and be weak and not able to swim to the top of the water and then get spurts of energy and eat for a few days.
Substrate is large river stones. I'll put a pic in and you can see some of them in the reflection. I have 1/2 the tank bare bottom to see his preference lately.
Temp doesn't fluctuate. It's a 4ft long tank w/ only him in there so lots of water. I'm water changing weekly or every 2 wks 20%.
The tail tip has always looked a bit mangled as you can see in the pic and hasn't changed. I just took this one of him and he looks good now and noticably a bit plumper since eating the last few days.
Thanks again

 

[Bellabelloo]

You do need to defrost any frozen food first. I do wonder if its something in his diet that may be causing the problems, frozen blood worm for an adult axolotl is not the best source of nutrition. If you can, carry on feeding the earthworm. If you look on line you may be able to order some earthworms , they are easy to keep.:happy:.
Looking at the latest pictures he doesn't seem too bad, a little feeding up won't go amiss.

 

[dazkeirle]

As an adult 2x a day or even daily seems very frequent.

My oldest would never eat that much daily.

1 - 2 medium earthworms and a single bloodworm cube every other day is usually fine for me.

Perhaps you're trying to feed him too much which is why he's struggling to swim about. Just because he's skinny doesnt mean he can eat any more than a fat axie each day.

 

[ted22]

Does seem alot to feed an adult, should be feeding 2 or 3 times a week at this stage. and Daz Gomez would eat that daily! hed just eat and eat then eat so much he'd throw up and then eat what he just threw up and get very fat (this diddnt happen but I imagine it is what it would be like if I gave in!) also with what you say "He'll stop eating and be weak and not able to swim to the top of the water and then get spurts of energy and eat for a few days." i think most axies are abit like that, its just what they do! But you have had the axie for 1 and a half years so you must know what is normal for the little guy and Its so good that you rescued him! 7 years on only bloodworms cant have done him much good!

Hope all goes well!

 

[kuphie]

Sounds like he had an unhealthy life before. Swimming in his own toxins and eating nasty food for 7 years. Continue to feed earthworms every other day and wait to see what happens.

 

[Joy]

Thanks everyone. Good comments. Just still trying to sort him out and probably being a mom who's a bit too worried

 

[Joy]

But one more question....I just fed him a cartepillar that was eating away at my mint plant. He seemed to like it, well, he ate it but I know they'll snap at anything. i know it's not an earthworm but is it ok for them to eat caterpillars and are they very nutritious for axies????

 

[axiegaz]

Do you know what type of catepillar it was? I'm sure it'll be fine but given that a lot of catepillars contain high levels of toxins/poisons to prevent predators from chowing down i'd be seriously cautious feeding them to my axie.
nutrition-wise - i'm not sure to be honest though, given that it is the laval stage of a moth or butterfly, i imagine it'll have a high fat content and therefore (if it's safe) should be given as a treat only.

 

[Joy]

It was a green caterpillar that was small. the kind in the Hungry Caterpillar book that we all read when we were little Nothing furry and weird. only about 1.5cm and maybe 4mm wide. My axie seems to be doing fine tho and just ate again today and has been swimming around so i guess all was good thanks tho b/c that's good to know for the future.:happy:

 

[wyogirl2007]

You don't have to dig up the worms..go to a fishing store, or some gas stations, etc. They sell them and you can keep the extras in the fridge. One axie will take a while to eat that many worms so you may want to get some worm food so the worms stay nutritious to eat. I rinse the dirt off and cut them into pieces the width of my axie's head.

 

[kuphie]

I don't recommend feeding insects from outside. They can harbor pesticides, fertilizer, parasites, fungus, or bacteria. It's like Russian Roulette, eventually you will chose the wrong one and it could prove fatal. Being overly cautious never hurt anyone. Worms from a worm farm are the best choice. Most bait worms are farmed.

 

[Joy]

That's good info. thanks guys. So I have a worm farm which are Brazilian worms I believe. They're red worms and great for a worm farm at least. Do you think they would be good to feed my axie? Thanks