Question: Newbie to CFB Newts Need Advice

[gelflin]

Please note that I previously posted this topic on the thread below but was advised by a helpful member to start a new thread.

Re: Keeping more than one Firebelly newt?
Hello to the community, my first post so bear with me and sorry if I have hijacked this thread or should have started a new one or been on an entirely different thread.

Short-ish background, my ten year old decides he wants fish, so we get him a community tank the usual, some Giant Danios, Platys, a couple of Zebra Danios, A Plec (small type), a Cory and some Garra Rufa. My husband goes to the fish shop to get a decent filter for my sons tank and falls in love with Guppies…..okay so now we have two tanks (husbands tank) Guppies, Guppies and more guppies with a Cory.

We are currently living with my brother and his girlfriend but it just hasn’t worked out for us, we miss our own space and well it seemed like a good idea at the time and hindsight is a wonderful thing! So we decide to move back to Peterborough and have our own house again, so we started the process of moving. My husband then goes and buys a (admittedly beautiful) Mahogany encased Aquarium over 5 and ½ ft for his guppies to be set up at the new house! So my brother goes and gets my husband a present two Chinese Fire Bellied Newts, now apart from one guppy that ended up in a newt belly we haven’t had any problems but the conditions aren’t ideal for the guppies or the newts, as I have a terminal illness that means I am mainly bed bound so I said get a new tank and it goes in the bedroom with the newts in it, I love them dearly and I am not a fish person anyway (but I do think that aquariums can look beautiful). But being upstairs mainly I wont get to appreciate the guppy tank so I am taking the newts on, besides I fell in love with them the moment I saw them.

I have purchased a 112ltr tank, which I have had a custom 3d background made for it, I want to go with an oriental river theme without silly ornaments and such, just sturdy (fake) plants to climb, Turtle docks, resin tree roots that come out of the water (with the roots to use as caves), floating foam lily pads with flowers (very oriental roud: basically lots of things to get out of the water and bask on), a air stone and a Fluval U2 filter. I have also got river stones and pebbles and river type substrate for the bottom, I want to try and recreate something between their natural environment and a river near a dense forest with tree saplings etc. growing out of the water towards the forest light.

Okay so here is my bundle of questions:

Does the set up sound right, any suggestions (except live plants, I would really love to but I have this magic touch with plants I can’t keep a green thing alive for more than 3 days!)? More on this below...

Could I get more CFB newts, and if so how many would you recommend for that size tank?

If I can have more CFB newts can anyone recommend where to get them, we will be in Peterborough UK and we don't drive, we have a great place near us called Water Zoo but they don't stock them?

They get on great with the Cory, (they just have staring matches over the pile of bloodworm) can I have a couple of Panda Cory’s and a couple of large snails?

I would love to be able to sex Frazzle and Cinders can anyone point me in the direction of a guide as the internet is full of conflicting information? More on this below....

Cinders is large and round bellied and eats anything and everything and is quite lazy, Frazzle is thin and we seem to be having trouble getting him to eat more than a few bloodworms a week (we didn’t see him eat for about 3 weeks), he is the more adventurous one though and even escaped the tank twice (my new tank has a sealed lid thank goodness) in every other way he seems happy and lively, does any one know why he isn’t really eating we have tried everything? More on this below....

As a complete novice I humbly ask for any advice that will help me and my little babies get on and make sure they are happy and have a long life. So please throw links, info advice or experiences my way?

Thank you to EVA for linking me to:
http://www.caudata.org/cc/species/Cynops/C_orientalis.shtml
http://www.caudata.org/cc/articles/articles.shtml

Which has raised a couple of questions, when trying to read up on the net about CFB newts I found many references stating that they should under no circumstance be put on substrate such as sand or small gravel that is easily swallowed, watching them 'pounce' live bloodworm out of their current larger gravel it makes sense as they aren't terribly accurate. Yet the Caudata on the species quotes “Always the water is cold and quiet, in the shade of grass, with a mud bottom free from stones, and the animals frequently swim up to the surface, darting back and forth actively."

So by having started the purchasing of all these river stones and pebbles and substrates have I got it way, WAY off? my thoughts were that the river smoothed pebbles etc. wouldn't hurt thier delicate skin as they are smooth and rounded unlike most aquarium substrates, and as mentioned earlier watching their feeding habits it made sense for them not to get a mouthful of sand or soil......HELP?

I would really love to put live plants in but I really am an expert plant killer, will it make them unhappy if I substitute for silk, fern and plastic plants?
At the moment Frazzle's favourite spot is on a large leafed tall plastic plant that he basks out of the water on, when we took it away for cleaning he sulked and sat on the filter then couldn't get back to the plant fast enough climbing over my hands as I was putting it back! where as Cinders needs a cave like area and spends most of her time in the water (so I will definitely include some hide away spots for her) at the moment she is using the back of the filter as a cave but funnily enough that's where all the baby guppies that have just been born go to hide out......hmmmmm :uhoh:

NB: although we just have automatically thought of Frazzle as HIM and Cinders as HER we have no idea. Cinders has always been bigger and rounder....okay she looks FAT! and Frazzle looks tiny in comparison although they are the same length Frazzle is slim and you can see his ribs which really worries me and next to Cinders he looks positively anorexic, but he is so active and the friendliest of the two so he must be eating as my husband got given them about two to three months ago and he is still with us and once when he escaped we tore apart the room looking for him, just as we gave up he decided to just crawl on to my husbands foot like he had just been out for a gentle stroll I will try and take on the information on how to sex them, though I feel way out of my depth on this....first ever newts :dizzy:

Thanking you all for your time and patience and sorry for babbling

gelflin

 

[evut]

Hi again!

I think you could have a couple more newts in the tank but the problem starts with where they come from - these are from a pet shop and so they were probably caught in the wild and transported from China. They might be ill - it will take some time to establish if they are well after their ordeal. If you buy more now, you will have to quarantine them for at least a month and you will be supporting the evil trade with wild caught animals again. It would be a good idea to wait and then try to find some captive bred ones to add to the tank later (you will still have to quarantine them, though). I know this sound complicated...sorry.

Your question about substrate: you have two options - sand or no bare bottom. Sand can be bought cheaply in a DIY store, just look for play sand. It will need to be rinsed. Sand is safe and looks pretty plus you can plant plants into it. Bare bottom tanks are easier to clean but you can't plant anything, obviously. If you search the forum you can find a lot of threads about this. Large pebbles are fine - anything that doesn't alter the pH and is smooth and too large for the newt to swallow is ok.

You said you can't grow plants - I wonder if you live in a hard water area? In that case there are only a few species of plants that will do well. But live plant are always good and the newts love them so try and find out what water you have and take it from there.

You said your newt "basks" - they don't do this, they just like to rest on land sometimes. If an adult newt is refusing to enter water then it's probably because there is something wrong with the newt or the water.

BTW - what temperature is the water? The newts don't do well if it's too warm. You should have good ventilation in the tank but make sure they can't escape through any holes. A large motor driven filter is not very good - it will raise the temperature and create a strong current which is both bad. An air driven sponge filter would be much better.

About the newts appetites, shapes and sex - could you post a picture of them?

 

[gelflin]

Thanks for all the information, they probably are pet shop brought as its the only way I can see my brother getting them, I have no problems with quarantine and would be happy to do that for them. Frazzle and my use of the term basking may be somewhat off, he is just the one that spends the most time out of the water, either just his eyes or nose then sometimes all of him but he will just as happily sit in the trees/plants in the water. Just compared to Cinders who only comes up for air then dinosaur walks her way up and down the tank like she owns it for ages before sitting in a cave (unless food is about) Frazzle just seems to 'bask' more but obviously I am not using the term right.

The current tank is lit by LED lighting which don't get warm so doesn't dry up the atmosphere, I will admit the tank is not big enough for the newts and other occupants as we never planned on the newts. We move in a weeks time and then both the community ....oops.... guppy aquarium and the newt tank can be set up. Although we use a Fluval U2 it's turned down to the lowest setting (with venturi on lower setting) any lower and it's off, initially it was a little higher but we noticed both newts wouldn't go in the water and quickly figured out it was the water flow. The problem is the Guppies like it higher but the newts NEED it lower, we turned the temperature down from the Guppies 24oC to 19oC which isn't really the best temperature for either species. But as mentioned my brother randomly got them and was told they would be fine with Guppies in a community tank and it was from a reputable aquatic centre, my brother and his girlfriend have their own 4ft tank with five axolotl's so we trusted his judgement as my husband is a Guppy expert and keep Fancy Show Guppies and has really educated himself on them only. So we had no idea about the special requirements of these lovely little creatures, as mentioned we have had them for about 3 months and Cinders certainly has tons of character and has settled fine, Frazzle has too but I do think he is shy of the Guppies, which soon won't be a problem just got to move and cycle the tanks.

With regards to plants, its nothing to do with the water sadly. It's me, I just have a knack for killing plants. Which has made me quite sad as I would love a planted tank and the plants from the newts natural environments are beautiful.

Hubby is going to try and take photos of the newts, Frazzle is fine as he loves me and happily crawls all over me but Cinders is more a kind of 'leave me alone I was happy' newt.

What About keeping Cory's and snails with them to help clean up or is a filter and water changes sufficient? My husband has suggested Marimo balls to help with algae and Nitrates and said they are really easy to keep and even I would be hard pressed to kill them off, is this a good suggestion?

Thanks for all your help
gelflin

 

[Azhael]

19ºC is perfectly good for the newts and shouldn´t be a problem for fancy guppies, they are more tolerant of lower temps than the original ones. Guppies aren´t a big threat as tankmates, they are usually ok in small numbers, but when you separate them you will most certainly notice a change in the attitude of the newts, they really like fishless waters.

If you are not good with plants, i´d recommend java moss and java fern. Hardy as hell and perfect for caudate tanks. You´d have a hard time killing those, hehe. You may also want to give Elodea or Anubias a try, but while they grow like weed for some people, they do badly for others, so it´s a bit hit or miss.

Try offering earthworms and waxworms to the newts. If one of them is skinny, it needs to gain weight as soon as possible, waxworms would help as they are rich in fat and few newts dare not eat them.

As well as the links Eva provided, you should really check the rest of the articles and roam around in the forums. You can use the search function to look for specific information or generally check the Cynops section which is full of advice. Good luck with your newts!!

Oh, and if you decide to get more, i wholeheartedly second Eva´s advice on looking for captive bred ones, you won´t be sorry if you do!

 

[zoezakella]

waxworms would help as they are rich in fart and few newts dare not eat them.

LOL Azhael, sorry its the child in me, blame my 4 year old son & 2 year old daughter who are obsessed with stinkies :rofl:

 

[Azhael]

xDDDDDDDDD
Sorry

 

[evut]

If you are not good with plants, i´d recommend java moss and java fern. Hardy as hell and perfect for caudate tanks. You´d have a hard time killing those, hehe.

...I know everybody keeps saying that but they really can't live in my tanks. I believe water hardness is a serious issue for them.
I personally can't see how gelflin can be so bad with plants... I mean these aren't roses we're talking about. Plants are very fussy but if you select the right ones for your conditions they should do well. It took me a while to find plants which can grow in my tanks but now that I've got the right species they are brilliant.
Regarding moss balls, they are pretty but don't expect miracles with algae problems.
Sorry I don't know anything about snails and fish so I can't give you any advice. Try searching the forum.

 

[Azhael]

A bit of trial and error may be required. As you say, Eva, water hardness and other factors can complicate things and limit which plants work. Mind you, most people don´t have problems with java moss and java fern.

I wouldn´t keep corys with the newts, gelflin. Newts can chemically sense the pressence of fish in the water, for some individuals this causes stress as they tend to avoid such situations in the wild. Snails will be fine, as would some types of fresh water shrimp.

 

[brainlady]

Hi, I am new to the forum and the keeping of CFB Newts. It was so reassuring to read your post..... I have many of the same questions. I have one little guy (?) called Nibby and I am in love!! I had no idea they could walk up the side of the tank.... panicked like crazy when I read that and then had to rig some sort of lid on the tank because it didn't come with one!! I had to laugh at your little fella walking on your husbands foot!!! Just thought I would say Hi!
Denise

 

[tman]

Hi i'm also a new CFB Newt owner and i wanted to know if i can keep a sword-tailed Newt with my CFB Newt?
If not is there any newts, salamanders or frog i can keep with him

 

[Kaysie]

No, you cannot.

There are no other species you can keep with your firebelly, save for 'feeder' species. Read about why not here.