Is my axolotl going to be okay ?

[Noodlesmom]

I’ve had my axolotl noodles for about 21/2 weeks. He’s a young axolotl and is in a tank filled with fakes plants, a hiding log, a eco-bio stone that I was told to help with bacteria and a filter air pump sponge filter, something like a small world filter. He’s in a 51/2 gallon tank which yes I know is small but I will be upgrading once I create the space available for a bigger tank to suite him. His water is filled a little more than half way up the tank. When I originally got him it was a surprise from someone so I was not fully prepared for the axolotl meaning I didn’t have a cycled tank or anything. The guy told my friend who gave it to me that he breeds them and it’s as easy as putting them in treated water and that axolotl will be fine and so that is what I had done but after doing so much intense research I saw that you need to have them in a cycled tank. I went back to the pet store and talked to someone else and she had told me I could cycle it with him in the tank. She gave me the eco stone, something called Fritz-zyme turbo start 700 and prime from seachem. She told me that it would take about a month to cycle and that once a week I needed to put a certain amount of turbo start into the tank until the bottle was empty. She said that it would get cloudy and when that happens to every 48 hours to put the prime in so the bacteria and ammonia doesn’t burn him. She also said that I shouldn’t do any water changes until the ammonia and nitrite levels are 0 and then the nitrate levels around from 0-5.0 ppm. He is on a strict diet of being fed frozen blood worms every other day and she told me not to feed him too much or it can effect the ammonia. I have been following exactly what she told me and it’s now the 18th day of the cycling and the ammonia levels and nitrite levels have stayed at 0 and nitrate is a steady 5.0ppm. Ph stays in the range of 7.2-7.6. And I have been controlling the temp to range around 18 Celsius. He eats fine when I put the food in. He poops at least once a week. My concern is the past few days the water smells so bad. It’s a mixture between ammonia and pond water smell. It just keeps getting stronger and I don’t understand why. Im also concerned how the levels have stayed the same throughout the cycling. When I asked the woman she said that means that the bacteria has caught up to the cycling so the cycle is just working faster. Also last night I noticed that Noodles gills are slightly curved. More curved than normal which from what I searched indicates stress. Im not sure if it’s due to the cloudy water. I have been doing the prime like the lady told me but the water is still cloudy. I just hope I’m not killing him and hurting him. Im so worried and I’m not sure what to do.

 

[AMurry24537]

Hm, I'm not sure what's going on with that, but I'll try spitballing some ideas I had while reading your post. Maybe one of them will help!

What kind of test kit are you using? It's possible that there may be something wrong with it. Consider taking a sample of your water to a pet store to confirm your test numbers. Quite a few of them will test it for free. I most highly suspect nitrates, since you haven't said how often you are doing water changes now that the tank is cycled. The only ways to get rid of nitrates are with live plants (which you didn't mention) and water changes. How often are you changing and what percentage of the tank?

I don't know much about eco logs; could that possibly be the source of the smell? I would maybe try taking it out for a couple days and tubbing it separately, just to see what happens. Your cycle should be maintained by the filter at this point without any additional problems.

Another long shot: are you absolutely certain that the smell is coming from the tank and not, perhaps, water that got splashed out the the side at some point or something?

I would also suggest that you consider tubbing Noodles until you can get this figured out. Hopefully it won't be for long!

 

[Noodlesmom]

Hm, I'm not sure what's going on with that, but I'll try spitballing some ideas I had while reading your post. Maybe one of them will help!

What kind of test kit are you using? It's possible that there may be something wrong with it. Consider taking a sample of your water to a pet store to confirm your test numbers. Quite a few of them will test it for free. I most highly suspect nitrates, since you haven't said how often you are doing water changes now that the tank is cycled. The only ways to get rid of nitrates are with live plants (which you didn't mention) and water changes. How often are you changing and what percentage of the tank?

I don't know much about eco logs; could that possibly be the source of the smell? I would maybe try taking it out for a couple days and tubbing it separately, just to see what happens. Your cycle should be maintained by the filter at this point without any additional problems.

Another long shot: are you absolutely certain that the smell is coming from the tank and not, perhaps, water that got splashed out the the side at some point or something?

I would also suggest that you consider tubbing Noodles until you can get this figured out. Hopefully it won't be for long!

So it’s definitely coming from the tank. I keep the area really clean as well as trying to keep the tank as clean as possible. The lady told me not to do any water changes while cycling. However, I called her today and explained the situation and she told me that this means my tank is fully cycled and that I should do a 25% water change. She also told me the smell won’t go away and to get carbon rocks and they apparently will help with the smell. I’m using the API fresh water kit which I know is the most commonly used one. My nitrate level is at 5.0 ppm but I thought that was the normal level. I’m definitely going to try the water change today and get the carbon rocks to see if it helps with the smell. I’m just afraid of stressing noodles out too much. I don’t have live plants but I did notice on the fake plants there’s some kind of film that’s growing on them. I thought it was maybe normal since you need bacteria in the tank.

 

[AMurry24537]

So it’s definitely coming from the tank. I keep the area really clean as well as trying to keep the tank as clean as possible. The lady told me not to do any water changes while cycling. However, I called her today and explained the situation and she told me that this means my tank is fully cycled and that I should do a 25% water change. She also told me the smell won’t go away and to get carbon rocks and they apparently will help with the smell. I’m using the API fresh water kit which I know is the most commonly used one. My nitrate level is at 5.0 ppm but I thought that was the normal level. I’m definitely going to try the water change today and get the carbon rocks to see if it helps with the smell. I’m just afraid of stressing noodles out too much. I don’t have live plants but I did notice on the fake plants there’s some kind of film that’s growing on them. I thought it was maybe normal since you need bacteria in the tank.

I would tend to disagree with the idea of not doing water changes with an "occupied" tank while cycling to be honest. Yes, not doing water changes does help the cycle go faster, but it's a LOT more dangerous for the occupant (and it's pretty dangerous even normally, particularly for an axolotl). Even with a fully cycled tank, most recommend a 20-30% water change at least every week.

Although I would definitely say that tanks have a particular smell, an odor that strong is not normal. Hopefully the carbon rocks help.

If you can, please try to add pictures of the film growing on the plants. This sounds like it's probably fungus, and could become a dangerous issue. Visible fungus is usually a sign of poor water quality, but it could also be that there's something in the plants that does not do well in water. Fungus a sign of bacteria, yes, but too much of a good thing is a very bad thing in this case. You should pretty much never be able to "see" the results of bacteria in a tank.

I'm also concerned with your description of cloudy water. That also is not normal, even in a cycling tank, and is another sign of something being there that's not supposed to be. Hope you can get this all figured out!

 

[Noodlesmom]

I would tend to disagree with the idea of not doing water changes with an "occupied" tank while cycling to be honest. Yes, not doing water changes does help the cycle go faster, but it's a LOT more dangerous for the occupant (and it's pretty dangerous even normally, particularly for an axolotl). Even with a fully cycled tank, most recommend a 20-30% water change at least every week.

Although I would definitely say that tanks have a particular smell, an odor that strong is not normal. Hopefully the carbon rocks help.

If you can, please try to add pictures of the film growing on the plants. This sounds like it's probably fungus, and could become a dangerous issue. Visible fungus is usually a sign of poor water quality, but it could also be that there's something in the plants that does not do well in water. Fungus a sign of bacteria, yes, but too much of a good thing is a very bad thing in this case. You should pretty much never be able to "see" the results of bacteria in a tank.

I'm also concerned with your description of cloudy water. That also is not normal, even in a cycling tank, and is another sign of something being there that's not supposed to be. Hope you can get this all figured out!

I would tend to disagree with the idea of not doing water changes with an "occupied" tank while cycling to be honest. Yes, not doing water changes does help the cycle go faster, but it's a LOT more dangerous for the occupant (and it's pretty dangerous even normally, particularly for an axolotl). Even with a fully cycled tank, most recommend a 20-30% water change at least every week.

Although I would definitely say that tanks have a particular smell, an odor that strong is not normal. Hopefully the carbon rocks help.

If you can, please try to add pictures of the film growing on the plants. This sounds like it's probably fungus, and could become a dangerous issue. Visible fungus is usually a sign of poor water quality, but it could also be that there's something in the plants that does not do well in water. Fungus a sign of bacteria, yes, but too much of a good thing is a very bad thing in this case. You should pretty much never be able to "see" the results of bacteria in a tank.

I'm also concerned with your description of cloudy water. That also is not normal, even in a cycling tank, and is another sign of something being there that's not supposed to be. Hope you can get this all figured out!

I tried to take pictures as good as possible.The first plant picture at the tip of the plant you can kind of see like a light film surrounding it and then like the last picture there’s a few little black dots on some butI’m not sure if it’s just food or even poop. The tank is cloudier than it looks in the pictures and last night I even did a 25%water change and I feel like it went straight back to being cloudy. I’m going to test the water levels today to see if anything happened. I posted a picture of noodles too to show the curve of his gills. I’m starting to get very worried and I’m wondering if I should take him out and put him in a container and then start completely over with cycling the tank a different way. But I don’t want to harm and stress him out too much and I’m worried about keeping him in a container for the time length it’ll take to cycle again. I’m not sure what to do but I will do anything to give him the best life.

 

[wolfen]

is the smell slightly like bad eggs, if so it will be from the eco rock, the surface area houses aerated bacteria (the type that convert/eats ammonia and nitrites called nitrifying bacteria) but the internal area houses denitrifying bacteria (the type that converts/eats nitrates). the smell is hydrogen sulphide venting to atmosphere, to reduce the nitrates and therefore the smell water changes are done, it isn't important to do water changes in a tank that is cycling using chemicals, but in a tank with livestock it is crucial, the best bacteria to use is pond filter start (the type that is used in the spring to boost the filter) as the bacteria needs to be able to function at cold temperatures unlike tropical which is a warmer climate.

 

[wolfen]

also the black bits could well be algae starting to grow and also even though the filter might be ok with small axie it is way to small for a full grown axie, the cloudiness is bacteria bloom in the water along with the slime it will reduce provided 1. the filter is big enough 2. water changes are done.

 

[Noodlesmom]

also the black bits could well be algae starting to grow and also even though the filter might be ok with small axie it is way to small for a full grown axie, the cloudiness is bacteria bloom in the water along with the slime it will reduce provided 1. the filter is big enough 2. water changes are done.

So I put some carbon in the tank and it has helped with the smell but it’s still so cloudy. I took out two of the three plants because I felt like they had just so much gunk on them. I’m in the process of actually cycling a 20g tank with a big filter. I’m using ammonia but I was still recommended to use the turbo 700 from the pet store. Is the turbo 700 bad to use? I’m trying to cycle this thank perfectly so when I do love my axolotl he’ll be happy and healthy.

 

[wolfen]

So I put some carbon in the tank and it has helped with the smell but it’s still so cloudy. I took out two of the three plants because I felt like they had just so much gunk on them. I’m in the process of actually cycling a 20g tank with a big filter. I’m using ammonia but I was still recommended to use the turbo 700 from the pet store. Is the turbo 700 bad to use? I’m trying to cycle this thank perfectly so when I do love my axolotl he’ll be happy and healthy.

the reason for the cloudiness is a over abundance of bacteria, at this moment in time it isn't so much as needing more bacteria its more a case of having bacteria in the right places, most important is in the filter (this is where 99% of bacteria should be) any bacteria elsewhere (eco rock, ornaments etc..) is a bonus. you have said that the ammonia and nitrites are a steady 0ppm don't add any more bacteria as it isn't needed and will only make the cloudiness worse, keep the temperature low and the ph to between 7.4 - 7.6 so if you do spike then it wont harm the axie (ammonia is less toxic at lower temperatures and ph) if the ammonia does start creeping up get a bigger filter (more bacteria is useless without somewhere to go), turbo 700 is just a culture of nitrifying bacteria that will colonise the filter to quick start the cycling or when something has happened to disrupt the nitrogen cycle. carbon and activated carbon (carbon that has more internal surface area for absorption) is brilliant for removing some pollutants (very good at removing trace chloramines), and chemicals but is not a cure all.

 

[wolfen]

on the tank you are cycling stop dosing with bacteria as soon as you start getting nitrates (although you could stop using them as soon as you get nitrites), you will just be adding them to the water column and unless you have ornaments, eco rock etc.. they will have nowhere else to go and cause a bacteria bloom again.

 

[Noodlesmom]

on the tank you are cycling stop dosing with bacteria as soon as you start getting nitrates (although you could stop using them as soon as you get nitrites), you will just be adding them to the water column and unless you have ornaments, eco rock etc.. they will have nowhere else to go and cause a bacteria bloom again.

So the pic is the new tank that I just got. I added ammonia and the turbo start Friday and then yesterday I added a bit more ammonia because I saw a decrease in ammonia but no increase in nitrites. Now is it weird to have nitrates already? Cause I have readings of 10pm. I read something like it may just be the nitrates already in my tap water but im not sure if it’s bad or not to have them already. The water is treated but I’m assuming it only helps with the chlorine and not already existing nitrates.

 

[Noodlesmom]

I’m also not adding the turbo to the existing tank anymore. I’m trying to get this new tank set up and ready as soon as possible so I can move him to a better environment but I also want to make sure I perfect cycling this new tank so I don’t have these same problems

 

[wolfen]

both the bacteria that converts/eats ammonia and nitrites are nitrifying aerobic bacteria and can be housed together and therefore sold in a bottle complete, so it isn't surprising for it to seem like step two has been skipped but as long as you have nitrates then nitrites were produced. it is the denitrifying bacteria (the ones that convert/eat nitrates) that are separate as they need a oxygen free environment.

 

[wolfen]

also water testing your tap water may help you to find out if it contains nitrates, but I would say that the bacteria is doing the conversion mainly because of the ammonia being reduced,

 

[Noodlesmom]

both the bacteria that converts/eats ammonia and nitrites are nitrifying aerobic bacteria and can be housed together and therefore sold in a bottle complete, so it isn't surprising for it to seem like step two has been skipped but as long as you have nitrates then nitrites were produced. it is the denitrifying bacteria (the ones that convert/eat nitrates) that are separate as they need a oxygen free environment.

I know it sounds bad but I’ve just been following what these people at the pet store and also the articles I’ve read online say. I’m not sure like if there was a certain bacteria I was supposed to buy. I’m trying to do as much research as I can but there’s so many sources saying different things so I’m a little lost.

 

[wolfen]

don't worry to much about it, it isn't how you get there, its that you get there in the end.

 

[Noodlesmom]

don't worry to much about it, it isn't how you get there, its that you get there in the end.

Yeah . So the turbo and nitrates are okay? I have seen a slight increase in nitrates, no nitrites, and like I said the ammonia dropped a little so I added some more today.

 

[wolfen]

Yeah . So the turbo and nitrates are okay? I have seen a slight increase in nitrates, no nitrites, and like I said the ammonia dropped a little so I added some more today.

sounds like everything is coming along smoothly, once the ammonia is 0 24hrs after dosing then the cycling is complete, do a water change and re-dose then if 24hrs later ammonia is zero then it is done. the easiest way of removing nitrates is through a water change. I would also recommend getting a airstone (The finer the bubbles the better as the idea is to increase oxygenation not water movement)

 

[Noodlesmom]

sounds like everything is coming along smoothly, once the ammonia is 0 24hrs after dosing then the cycling is complete, do a water change and re-dose then if 24hrs later ammonia is zero then it is done. the easiest way of removing nitrates is through a water change. I would also recommend getting a airstone (The finer the bubbles the better as the idea is to increase oxygenation not water movement)

Awesome! I’ll definitely get an airstone. So if I don’t see nitrites at all but the ammonia does it’s thing and the nitrates are okay, that’s okay to not see them? This was a main concern I had for the tank I have him in now.

 

[wolfen]

Awesome! I’ll definitely get an airstone. So if I don’t see nitrites at all but the ammonia does it’s thing and the nitrates are okay, that’s okay to not see them? This was a main concern I had for the tank I have him in now.

the nitrogen cycle is waste > ammonia > nitrites > nitrates > water change/plants/denitrifying bacteria, so yes its fine.