Housing morphs...

jbherpin

jbherpin

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I was wondering how many morphs should be raised communally? I don't want there to be an over-crowding issue, or a situation that has only the largest most aggressive morphs feeding. Should I seperate by size, by number, or what? I know when they become noticably larger than the rest, it is best to seperate them. What is the rule on size vs space for morphs? Lastly, they are kept in very simple set-ups, how long can I keep them this way? By "simple", I mean bare bottom with some moss for shelter and to pick white worms out of.
Any advice will be appreciated!

-jbherpin-
 
Hi, What species of morphs you are trying to keep?

I have had up to 30 morphs of CO in a 10 gallons container terrestrially without any problem. However, I guess it varies based on how you are feeding them. I was handfeeding my morphs one by one, so I have more control on who was eating and the speed of their growth.
 
Hi-
I am raising 4 groups. I have l. helveticus, l. vulgaris, l. boscai, and m. a. alpestris. I put a large "pinch" of whiteworms under the moss patch, and a second on the top. I provide 0 water, with the exception of a misting here and there. I am currently using tupperware to house the groups.

Thanks for the reply, and the interest!

-jbherpin-
 
The number of terrestrial morphs of those species really shouldn't matter much as long as you provide enough food and shelter. Also, you'll need to clean the enclosure a bit more often. Lissotriton are usually peaceful, so aggression shouldn't be an issue even when mixing small with larger juveniles. You can use a layer of chemical-free soil mixed with coco-fibre mulch as a substrate, or simply damp paper towels. It's a good idea to have a damp side and a dry side so the newts are able to hang out in the area of the tank where they feel most comfortable. There is no time limit on simple tanks! Some people might complain and say it's unnatural to keep them in simple bare bottom or paper towel set ups, but there really is nothing natural about keeping them in a glass box in the first place! Simple set ups are good because you can observe the animals behavior and they are easy to maintain.
 
Jake said:
The number of terrestrial morphs of those species really shouldn't matter much as long as you provide enough food and shelter. Also, you'll need to clean the enclosure a bit more often. Lissotriton are usually peaceful, so aggression shouldn't be an issue even when mixing small with larger juveniles. You can use a layer of chemical-free soil mixed with coco-fibre mulch as a substrate, or simply damp paper towels. It's a good idea to have a damp side and a dry side so the newts are able to hang out in the area of the tank where they feel most comfortable. There is no time limit on simple tanks! Some people might complain and say it's unnatural to keep them in simple bare bottom or paper towel set ups, but there really is nothing natural about keeping them in a glass box in the first place! Simple set ups are good because you can observe the animals behavior and they are easy to maintain.
Click to expand...

Jake-

You're the best! I appreciate your input on this, and feel much better about how they are being maintained.

-jbherpin-
 
I have almost 60 C. orientalis morphs in about 5-6 different containers, ranging from critter keepers to 10 gallon tanks. Most are in the shoe box sized sterilite (large, sturdy tupperware) containers. I group them according to size and keep them in groups of about 10. I have one of the critter keepers for my first four morphs and one for another set that I've photographed from the egg stage on until now. I feed them springtails and flightless fruit flies. So far, I've had only one mortality. I have only a few mature larvae yet to morph.

Good luck,
Dana
 
What are you using for substrate vistajpdf? How moist are you keeping it? I can't wait until they all get beyond that tiny fragile stage! I am losing sleep! Lol!
Thanks for your interest!

-jbherpin-
 
I had written a longer response but it never posted the other day, so I wrote again but forgot to add this about the substrate! I started my first morph out on coco-fiber (the brick type of material you add water to and it swells) but quickly heard about one member's morph accidentally ingesting it and dying, so I changed to wet paper towels. The paper towels are changed 2-3 times per week and are not dyed or decorated at all. They are plain white. In a pinch, I've used towels with minor decorations on them but I think it's best to avoid anything with dyes added. It's much easier to find the morphs on the plain white towels, too! Some containers have very shallow water bowls in them, but others do not. I have a rare morph here and there who takes little swims, but most use the hides whenver I look in on them. I have at least one "hut" for them to hide in/under per container, with a lot of other sheltered areas consisting of fake plants.

Good luck,
Dana
 
Dana-

Thanks for the replies! I think when the moss needs changed I will go with damp paper towels as well. I like the moss for dropping the white worms into. The morphs seem to enjoy foraging through the patches and finding the worms crawling through it. I worry that the worms will be lost on/in the paper towels...will the morphs be able to see them, and will the worms stay in the open, or simply go under the towels?

Thanks!

-jbherpin-
 
jbherpin said:
The morphs seem to enjoy foraging through the patches and finding the worms crawling through it. I worry that the worms will be lost on/in the paper towels...will the morphs be able to see them, and will the worms stay in the open, or simply go under the towels?
Click to expand...
I haven't used whiteworms a lot so I can't say for sure, but I know blackworms will eventually get under the paper towels, or even between the thin sheets making it almost impossible to remove them without destroying the towels. The brown paper towels you find in many public bathrooms work great, and have never been bleached like the white ones. I'm not saying the white ones are bad, but almost everything I've read suggests to use the non-bleached paper towels for amphibians.
 
Azhael had suggested the unbleached paper towels, but when were pm'ing, I decided that I thought he meant undyed or decorated ones. I asked about the brown ones and he didn't seem to think that was what he meant, citing them possibly as an American thing. However, mine are fine on the plain white ones and Azhael has never let me down with advice. Personally, I prefer to not have the towels treated at all, to be honest. Now I'm not sure what to do. I wasn't sure if the white ones were bleached or what.

I only briefly tried the worms (both black and white) post-morphing to no avail. I put a clump of dirt in the enclosure w/ the worms but they didn't see interested. I used the tilted tank for awhile leaving part of the tank with a shallow amount of water, hoping the new morphs would go for the blackworms as they had while larvae, but they did not. I didn't try the blackworms once I went to a flat tank.

Mine have only FFs and springtails. I have got to find some pinhead crickets.

Good luck,
Dana
 
Dana-

I have used whiteworms for aquatics and terras...That is their benifit! I suggest using some white worms (supplementally, they are kind of fatty) in a small lid of sorts. I use the tops of baby food stage whatever food lids. They are plastic, easy to clean, and renewable if needed. Another benefit is that they are shallow. I also like them for small water containers for my larger morphs. They like a shallow soak at night sometimes. I am happy to provide it! Lol. The towels are good, but for me, using food prey that escapes into the paper, I am going bare-bottom with a patch or 2 of moist moss. It is working well, and the ff I use are too quick. I will be using the maggots of melongaster when I get my new culture.

From what I am told, all white towels are bleached. But considering your success, maybe it doesn't matter as much as previously thought!

Thank you for the continued replies and interest! I will hope to hear feedback, and will certainly update the post if I make changes!

-jbherpin-
 
Dana, I forgot... Get your pinhead from a local herp show as many pinhead shipments arrive with a vast number DOA (dead on arrival). This is from experience of my mother and I both from different suppliers. Trust me, you don't want pinheads via the mail! PM me with any questions about local shows, and what is a reasonable cost, etc.

-jbherpin-
 
Thanks Nathan!

-jbherpin-
 
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