Cynops orientalis (Chinese Fire Belly Newt) laying eggs!

[steve]

Hi all, Im currently trying to breed a couple species. (as my other posts suggest) I was trying for crested newts first. TO MY SURPRISE my fire belly beat them to it and surprised me ON CHRISTMAS day! (christmas babies LOL)

Anyways, for all you experts:

she's only laid about 4-5 I can see. Is this normal for her to lay only 5 eggs (in different locations) over 2 days? How long before I see more and WILL I see more (i.e. 100 more, etc..?)

I removed all other occupants from the tank, it's just her in there right now. I also put some garbage liners in there after I witnessed her dropping an egg on a plastic plant, but she hasnt used it yet.

let me know the above and any other IMPORTANT info you would like to add.

thanks
Steve

 

[(unregistered]

congrats, sounds exciting
what do garbage liners do?

 

[jennifer]

Hi Steve, that's great! I got a similar gift from my newts too - my C. pyrrhogaster started laying on Christmas eve. I've never had orientalis, but the number of eggs you describe sounds typical for pyrrhoghaster. I've never seen them lay a ton of eggs at once, it's been a gradual process, a few at a time. If you look around the tank really, really carefully you might find some that you haven't seen yet. They hide them well, sometimes in odd places.

To unregistered: plastic strips from garbage bag liners can used as an artificial egg-laying substrate. Some newts like it better than real plants. Here is a picture of two types I have made. The black ones were made using aquarium epoxy putty, the clear ones using pebbles and rubber bands.

 

[steve]

one more thing, will the mother harm the eggs? I know I will probably remove her when they hatch, but how about before? Im unsure only for the reason: what if she lays more? (maybe just move them to thistank after?)

steve

p.s. jen: any photos?

 

[steve]

updated photo of mommy and eggs. I counted around a dozen today.

steve

 

[richardh]

Yes! The mummy will eat the eggs! What I do each year with my clutches is remove them from the plastic plants-mine are subdivideable with detachable segments. Place these plant segments with eggs attached and place in water of equivalent temperature that has been stood 48 hours or more.Replace the water every so often with partial water changes. Remove eggs with any fungal conditions(looks like white fluff) Place at most 4-5 eggs in each small container. If you haven't already, invest in a brine shrimp hatchery to feed your offspring when they hatch in a couple of weeks or so!!!

 

[steve]

I could use a bigger container i have which could probably house more then 4-5. (unless this is not good?) Actually, I do have a brine shrimp hatchery which Ive successfully hatched them. (i havent been able to raise to adult size without death though? I need a heater for the bigger "raise" tank, I think.) I will try to remove the plant "parts" and compensate with garbage liner plants, although she hasnt used these yet. (prefers algae infested plastic plants)

Also: will the algae hurt the eggs?

steve

 

[rob]

mommy looks a little plump, did she lay any more?

 

[richardh]

No- algae in moderation will not hurt the larvae-some authorities believe that it helps to oxygenate the developing larvae. I am not a believer in the 'extreme hygene' school of husbandry for this species. Keep clean within reason -the biggest killer of larval orientalis is air bubbles and over filtration/reticulation of water etc. I use a small black hatcher with a transparent collecting jar inverted above a small opening for the brine shrimp-this allows brine shrimp larvae to collect seeking the brighter light in the fresh water filled jar-no washing needed! there will not be enough prey proximity if you use too large a contaner for your larval newts-10x10 X 15 cm long is fine in the first couple of weeks-to be followed by a lidded tilted penpal with a ground area prior to metamorphosis-they should be eating full bloodworms by this stage. Remove waste (very carefully) with a baster every day or so. Replace the water with well stood water after you do this.

 

[jennifer]

Steve, it's not easy to raise brine shrimp to adulthood. I don't think that the typical brine shrimp hatchery is designed for that, it's only used to hatch them and keep them alive for a day or two. Also note that the nutritional value of brine shrimp goes steadily downward after they hatch, so it's best to use them right away. If you need adult brine shrimp, you can probably buy live ones at a local pet store, it's a lot easier that way!

 

[steve]

rich: how do you know if they have "gas bubbles"? (i asked on another post too)

*Why is AIR and OVER filtration bad again? I thought clean water was good water? (wondering)

Jen: I actually had another (seperate) container for the brines to grow. I fed them yeast at the time, but now have "actual brine food" bought from a local pet store. the temps in the shrimp container (not the hatchery) was low at around 60F-down, so i wonder if that and the "yeast alone" was the problem for death.

have you raised any to adult hood? I heard it can take only 3-4 weeks. My local store has live brine, 5-6 cups (water included) for about $6.00 that's why i wanted to raise my own too. (expense)

*shoot me, caudata is now Artemia.org conversations LOL.

steve

 

[jennifer]

I'm not Richard, but I can pretend. If they get gas bubbles, they float. I had it happen to one larva that I was keeping in my daphnia culture (probably due to poor water quality, not over-airation). IMO, the only over-airation would happen if you were using some kind of airstone or filter that produced very, very fine bubbles. Most ordinary devices won't do that.

Artemia.org, LOL. I let one hatchery run for a few weeks and ended up with ONE full-grown brine shrimp. I guess it lived on the nutrients left by the others, since I wasn't feeding them. You can get supplies for raising adult artemia at lfscultures.com. Unfortunately, LFS won't give out instructions until you buy from them. By the time newts are big enough for larger brine shrimp, they are also large enough for other easier/cheaper foods, so I've never bothered with artemia beyond the hatchling stage. Steve, do you have a source for inexpensive artemia cysts?

 

[richardh]

Yep I think my last message may not have been posted successfully-They float and the adults may show signs of embolisms around the eyes and along the body sometimes although you have to differentiate between these and normal skin glands-fridge for the larvae-definite water change for the adults might need up to half water change at once with well stood dechlorinated water as this condition is not good-try an ice pack outside of tank to reduce temperature.

 

[richardh]

With respect to brinshrimps I have raised them to adulthood just by not harvesting all of the brine shrimp-these extra large specimens will not have any food value for orientalis larvae more a question whether the baby orientalis would be good tucker for the shrimps!!! I guess large adult orientalis might eat the shrimps but this would be an unneccessary and expensive way of feeding them.

 

[steve]

ive fed my spotted newts, CFB, wartys, all adult shrimp before. (store bought) it's expensive, yes, but a bit less if raised at home. Salt and water is cheap, and i bought an 8 ounce bag of PREMIUM cysts that can hatch 240,000 shrimp per gram (8 ounces=227.76gram =59,000,000+ shrimp for $18.95) compared to LFS=$6.00 for 5 cups w/ water.

I love watching the newts stalk and attack the shrimps. The brine food i recently found is about $2.49 for a little container.

the web site is:
http://brineshrimpdirect.com/brineshrimpproduct1.htm#premium

RICH: i meant is algae good for the eggs to be around? not the larvae.

steve