Question: Cycling help.

[AbrahamAxolotl]

Hi everyone. I got my first axolotl about two months now. I know what cycling IS and test daily for ammonias, nitrates, nitrites etc with the API Liquid Test Kit. I also know about decholrinizing the water.
The problem is I didn't know this BEFORE getting my baby, and it was only about a few days AFTER that I was told. Naturally this means I had no choice but to go the "fish-in" route with cycling (daily water changes to keep the ammonia low).

Currently my axolotl is in a 10 gallon tank but over the course of the next week I will be moving him into a 40 gallon. This tank will also not be cycled as I only have, and can only afford, the one filter which is currently connected to his current tank (and it runs inline with the chiller which can not be undone in my case). My filter is a canister filter rated for up to 75 gallons and the chiller is rated for up to 150 I believe (it could be higher but I don't remember). Inside the filter is filter floss, followed by ceramic rings, followed by more filter floss - each in it's own 'section' (the filter came with three or four 'drawers'). No carbon as I read it gets toxic after a month. I don't know if this is common of all filters, but in order to open the thing and change media I would have to drain the entire filter, hoses, and chiller (since it's run inline) - so monthly carbon changes just seemed very daunting and so I skipped it.

Now on to the questions:

1. This filter has been running in my tank for about two months. Due to "fish-in" cycling is it normal that it is still NOT cycled (ammonia reads 1ppm - 2ppm daily and nitrates/nitrites 0)
2. Will switching him to the 40g tank erase any bacteria build-up in the filter? Will having more water volume cause the ammonia levels to rise SLOWER? Meaning I could go from DAILY water changes to perhaps every OTHER day water changes safely? I work and go to school full-time so reducing water changes is absolutely key.
3. How long would fish-in cycling normally take in a 10g? In a 40g? Will cycling be accomplished by Thanksgiving? (I would like to go away for a few days but if I need to change the water daily obviously I can not do this).
4. During water changes I typically turn off my filter/chiller as once I get about 50% of the water out the filter hose starts to suck in a bit of water. Upon turning the filter back on I then have to pump the hose to get the air out. Pumping the filter/chiller causes debris to get into my tank. They're thin, clear, flat-looking, and vary in shape and size. Typically they settle onto the sand/decor and I scoop any others out during the next water change. What are these? Are they harmful? (I've been told they are not but I want to double check) Is this the bacteria from the filter that is supposed to be staying IN the filter? Is this interrupting/preventing my cycle from establishing?

Sorry for all of the questions, I just worry about my little baby all the time and want to make sure I am keeping him safe and healthy. Naturally I would LOVE to not have to change the water daily (and it would get my grandma off my case because she lives with me and she always has to make a comment about how "it takes up so much of your time!" - which it takes like 15/20 minutes so not THAT long) but if that's what I have to do to keep him safe that's what I have to do. I'm just beginning to feel like I'm doing something wrong, however, since it's been two months and there's still NO cycle at all. I'm almost beginning to think that I'm going to be spending YEARS changing the water daily and that no cycle will EVER happen and that I wont be able to go visit family for thansgiving/christmas etc.. D:

 

[keiko]

Honestly the easiest thing to do would be to set up the new tank, put the filter in and cycle that without the axie in it. That way you could keep the ammonia at about 4 ppm and it'll be faster. 1-2 ppm ammonia is way too much and you need to do bigger water changes or more often if you're keeping your axie in there. Ammonia should be max 0.5 ppm right before water change. While cycling the new tank you can keep the axie in a separate container with daily 100% water changes.

Fish-in cycling takes a long time, but it is a bit odd that after two months you're not seeing even any nitrites. What kind of water conditioner do you use? Have you cleaned the filter?

 

[AbrahamAxolotl]

I haven't cleaned the filter, as I wasn't aware I had to and I figured that'd interrupt cycling. I can't filter the new tank without my axie in it because my filter is connected to my chiller and I can't disconnect them (or leave my axie without a chiller for two+ weeks by moving both to the new tank). =/

I use tetra(?) brand. It's the only one I found at my local pet store that says it only is a dechlorinizer. It also has slime coat? Which I was told wont hurt him. I add it to new water prior to putting it in the tank when I do water changes - there's only a 5g and 10g measurement so I usually put the 5g measurement in the new water since it's about a 3-4g bucket. I mean, the water in the tank doesnt feel slimy and my axie looks healthy and eats so I figure the tiny extra amount of dechlorinizer doesnt hurt him.

 

[Xtophr]

Carbon doesn't get toxic after a month, it just doesn't do anything.

I think I've read bad things about at least some of the "slime coat" products via-a-vis axies, but I might be wrong; you might want to search the forums for the product name you're using. Supposedly some interfere with Purigen and turn it toxic. API Tap Water Conditioner is the basic stuff that works on chlorine, chloramine, and heavy metals.

Keiko is right on the ammonia levels. 2 is bad...

If you go with a larger tank, you may be able to go longer between water changes, but they will be larger.

There are no hard and fast rules on how long cycling takes. Besides perhaps "longer than you want it to"..

But two weeks is an unrealistically low number even for fishless without seeding material.

Getting an inexpensive plastic 1ml syringe will allow you to be precise with dechlorinator and/or ammonia for fishless cycling. A 10 ml comes in handy for filling the api test tubes quickly without putting your hand in the water.

If you have 0 nitrites and 0 nitrates, that means that you don't have anything really going on cycle-wise with your filter - moving it should be fine anyway; you'd just lose anything built up on the surfaces of the tank and substrate. Just don't let the filter media dry out. Radical temp, pH, and hardness changes should probably be avoided.

If you want to go with a second tank using fishless cycling, you could buy an inexpensive sponge filter and air pump for that one, if the chiller is needed for your axie.

The debris you're seeing may be hard water deposits? I'm assuming these are inanimate objects? Nitrifying bacteria don't tend to come off of ceramic media, unless you're scrubbing it. Or kill it with untreated tap water. You might be able to avoid the mess by backwashing your filter when draining it. Or, just don't drain the water below the intake of the filter.

The time it takes to cycle a tank is going to depend on the bio load you're throwing at it, as well as the temperature, which, with axies, is lower than ideal for nitrifying bacteria to reproduce. With fishless, you can crank the temps to 86F.

If you're gone for any amount of time, you're going to want to have someone checking the parameters, doing pwcs, and feeding in any case...

 

[AbrahamAxolotl]

Yeah, it used to be my ammonia was at 0.50 pretty constantly but now it's at 1-2ppm constantly though I am thinking this is because my axie has gotten bigger therefore the bioload increased and my 10g tank can't handle it (which is why I'm switching him to a 40g I got). I'm just worried it'll take even /longer/ to cycle the 40g since it'll probably take the ammonia more time to build up in the first place.

I'm also wondering if I put far too many ceramic rings in the filter if that's even a thing. ahah

I googled sponge filters and honestly, this is my first time keeping an aquarium, I have no idea how they work. Like how do I set one up and then what do I do when I move over my cannister and chiller? How to I get the cycled media from the sponge filter into the cannister filter?

I wish there was a way to just buy cycled media. Would make everyone's lives so much easier. lol

 

[Cacique]

For a commercial sponge filter, you would just take the air line from an air pump and connect it, the air blowing out through the sponge filter will suck water in through the sponge and filter it. To put sponge filter media, you could just squeeze the used sponge into the new tank's filter, but I think Xtophr just meant to have the sponge filter in the smaller tank while the bigger one cycles with the canister filter.

You can always keep your small tank half full and filter-less and do every day or twice daily water changes while your bigger tank cycles. I don't think you can have too much ceramic media, you would just have more biological filtration than mechanical, but as long as you have enough filter floss there shouldn't be a problem.

They sell bacteria in a bottle, kind of what you're saying. I've used them but I wouldn't really recommend them as I feel they cost a nice chunk of change and you have to keep putting it in for a good time, they recommend with every water change, and I'm not sure if they're safe for axolotls. I'm also not sure how much they sped any of my tanks cycle up, if at all. I was hopeful, but even to get it's effect you need prolonged use, so not worth it. There's also no way to tell if the bacteria is alive, unless you go by the smell in the bottle, which still isn't really proof to me.

The closest thing IMO that could work is finding a friend, family member or trusted LFS and get some of their used filter media. If you did this, you want to always keep the thing in water, then just take the media out and put it into the filter without squeezing it (unless it's a sponge and you can't actually stick it in there). You want to do it without squeezing it or washing it in any way, so you would have to make sure the previous tank is healthy.

 

[Xtophr]

I wish there was a way to just buy cycled media. Would make everyone's lives so much easier. lol

There is. I can't vouch for them as I haven't tried it, although I would be interested if anyone else has:

Biologically Active Sponge Filters for Aquarium

 

[Xtophr]

Here's an article against using bottled bacteria, and, some reasoning that says lower levels of ammonia, etc.. may be better:

Nitrifying bacteria

As far as sponge filters go, I used one initially with an air pump in a fishless cycling tank, then migrated it to a larger tank and built an adapter to connect it as a pre-filter to my canister filter, then later took it out and used it in another tank with an air pump.