Agonizing over tempoeratures

A

alan

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My tanks run at 18-20C (64-68F) winter, up to 25C (77F) in summer. What species could I realistically keep/breed?
 
77 is real hot for most caudates. During the summer you would have to put ice packs in. 65-75 works for alot, check out other poeples newts to see what intrests you and are available in your region.
 
Alan is this the actual temperature inside the tank at the ground level? Or is this the temp higher up by the lights?

Assuming it is the temp at ground level the following all will do well within in that temp min-max range

Cynops ensicauda ssp
Cynops cyanureus
Pleurodeles waltl
Tylototriton shanjing
Notophthalmus ssp
Pseudobranchus
Siren
Amphiuma

Ed
 
i don't think i've heard of anyone with the last three genuses in Britain. i'd jump at the chance to get some pseudobranchus.

(Message edited by will_j on February 05, 2005)
 
Those are pretty much ground/water temps. I've been looking at all the species sheets in CC. The P.walti sheet implies they really like it cooler (never tried them myself). C.ensicauda is a given. I kept C.orientalis in this room and they survived, but were not happy.
 
I think P. waltl is more tolerant than what the caresheet implies. I've seen a couple of adult waltl tolerating temperatures that you have quite well. I would also add C. pyrrhogaster and Tylototriton verrucosus to the list.
 
Ed:

Cynops cyanureus likes it that much warmer than Cynops orientalis?
(D*mn, why did I pass up on those eggs :)
 
Realistically? Everybody blabs blabs blabs about Cynops orientalis being not that temperature tolerant, however I keep and breed this species and they are maintained at a temperature range similar to the one you are describing. I have absolutely no problem with these newts at these temperatures. In their 3 year stint living with my not so vigilent boyfriend, and now over the past half-year living with me (I am generally more careful with the animals) there have been a number of successful breedings. I find they often breed more than once a year and the offspring grow up quickly and are breeding within 1.5 years. The only time I have ever had a problem was when they moved to my home last fall, and were actually placed in a cooler basement environment, one of the females decided to become reclusive and stopped eating. I isolated her in an aquatic tank and she is back to eating and behaving normally.
Anyway, my point is that the tank is about 24-26 C for about 2 months out of the year and the newts display absolutely no abnormal behavior during this time. I have had a friend who obtained offspring from me and her newts died in a heat-wave where the temperature in her apartment was over 30C for a number of days, but ultimately i think that if these newts are exposed to gradual temperature changes on an annual cycle they are generally OK. Does anybody else have this experience?
 
Tara, you are not the first to report keeping C.o. at that temperature. I think the keys to your success are (1) good healthy newts (2) gradual acclimitization. For newts that have just survived importation, I do think that cooler temps give them a better chance at survival. I would also say that they probably wouldn't breed if they were kept at that temp year-round. Just out of curiosity, what is their typical water temp during the winter?

Here is an interesting article by Sergé Bogaerts about temperature tolerance during a heat wave:
http://home.hetnet.nl/~dresens/salamandervereniging/docs/Temptol5-1UK.pdf
In that case, some C.o. did manage to survive up to 30C.
 
Brrrrr, actually now the tank sits at a balmy 18-19C and we (that includes me) are in a basement environment. In the past the wild caught parents (the ones that lived with my boyfriend) have generally had a winter temperature of 20C during the day. The captive bred offspring have lived with me and have had winter temperatures of 16-18C (in my living room, yes I am insane).
One year my boyfriend decided he did not want the newts to breed anymore so he put a heater in the tank at the end of summer to prevent a temperature drop and the eventual rise that results in breeding. He tried to keep the tank around 22C. It did not stop the breeding, and by October we witnessed the inevitable laying of eggs. I think I am cursed by these buggers, my plants are presently weighed down with eggs, and I have a few new larva pop up in my tank every few months which are able survive to metamorphosis without my help (kind of - i tend to drop food in their general direction).
On the other hand two of my female Tarichas appear to be bursting with eggs but nobody is laying. Cruel fate.
T
 
Hi Alan,
I keep them in that temp range at work and have had no problems for more than a decade along with multiple reproductions.

Tara, the problem is that most houses do not undergo a gradual temperature shift during the seasons. Usually in the early spring and summer the houses are allowed to get above 26/27 C all at once as a sunny warm day occurs. This results in excessive stress and often kills the animal. There are a number of studies in caudates that looked at the thermal maxima (Tmax) to determine the temperature at which death occurs and in all of the studies for which I have seen the results, gradual increases are tolerated better.

Ed
 
Perhaps everybody should move to Nova Scotia, or failing that 45 degrees latitude. Four distinct seasons, gradual temperature changes; cold, wet, miserable, snowy winters, no sunday shopping - I can't wait to leave.
T
 
I have a feeling we're north of Nova Scotia here.
Bloody Gulf Stream / global warming!
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