30 gallon tank

[fishian]

Hello Im new and have a few question (already wrote this before but pressed backspace and didnt save)
Anyway.. I have recently created a half land half water tank out of a 30 gallon breeder and have been researching FB newts for a few weeks now (mainly thinking about chinese kind) and have a few questions.
How many should I get, how active are they, would they require a cooling unit during the summer (gets up to 30 C here in summer), how easy are they to breed, are they social animals (seen them "hudled" up to each other in store), do they require filtration, could I keep white cloud mountain minnows with them or is fish not an option no matter what, is 6 inches too deep for them (plexiglass land section is around 6 inches deep). Thanks I just have a few more amphibian related questions if you dont mind answering them
I have a tiger salamander I raised form a larva (saved 50 dollars form buying as adult plus keeping the larva was fun) and right now he lives in a 15 gallon tank, half moss, and half bare bottom tank with very low level water (a couple MM) with a few plastic plants. Should I turn the tank full land only or is it fine?
I have 5 FB toads in a 10 gallon, is this too small for them, they "seem" happy but from what I have read at caudate central that is a poor attitude for pet keeping.
Thanks for your help.

 

[rob]

I will try to help.

30 G is huge for CFBNs. You don't need the half land part though..I suggest removing it. CFBNs are pretty much aquatic except when they're young they go through an eft stage. If you intend on setting up a whole breeding colony in one tank, that may work, but also you have to watch that there is enough cover so the adults don't eat the young. If it gets that hot inside your house then you will need something to keep them cool. You can put white cloud minnows in with them, but again if you intend to breed them in that tank I would (fish will eat the larva, and maybe the eggs). 6 inches of water isn't very deep. If you can raise the depth of water even more that would be great, but 6 should be fine. The more water though the more of a buffer for waste and left over food you have. I would put filtration in, but just an air pump driven spounge filter. Clean their water every couple weeks (10-25%). THey're not social. If they're huddled up it's because that one spot is ideal for them and they all plop together to try and avoid all that other spots which aren't. I tcould even change location daily. If you remove the land section and fill the tank 3/4 full with water, I don't see why you couldn't raise 8 or 9 CFBNs in a tank that size. Other people may disagree though. In the FAQs on caudatecentral they talk about the number of inches of animal per surface area of the tank bottom. I forget the exact ratio so reading that may help.

Tiger salamanders SHOULD be housed on dirt....at least a few inches deep so they can burrow. Remove the water, but you can put a small water dish in if you wish. Not too deep though, they can drown. The moss may be bad for him depending on what kind it is.

I don't know much about FBTs, but 5 animals in a 10 gallon sounds to me like you may be pushing it a bit much. Maybe someone else knows better.

 

[jennifer]

I agree with all that Rob wrote, but have some additional comments. I see from your profile that you live in Canada. How often does it hit 30C there? If it's rare (couple of times a year) you don't really need a chiller. You can put frozen water bottles in during the hottest times. Use a screen lid, if possible, as evaporation will help keep the water cooler. (And speaking of lids, CFB are notorious escape artists, there cannot be even the tiniest crack for them to get out.)

One possible suggestion would be to use the 30-gallon for the 5 toads (they do need a bigger tank), and you could keep up to 4 CFB in the 10-gallon (all-water setup with island).

 

[rob]

I missed those key points. I agree with everything she says as well.

 

[fishian]

Yah the toads are in a sort of all water with island set up now, thanks for your help, I am amazed at the short time it took for a response.

I also have an old 25 gallon I might use for the toads if I go for the newts in the big tank though.

 

[tara]

Rob
What do you mean not social? Shame

My CFBs (adults, ok so they are not really mine but my boyfriend's)as well as my jeuvies are totally social. When they pass each other in the tank they are all like hello, good day to you comrade...often with nose touching and much curiosity as to what their newt friend is up to. There are now three of them together. The two girls hang out together much more than they do with the boy. This year when we removed the boy to keep him from impregnating the girls (unfortunately we were too late) he started to act weird, much differently than he did when in the tank and he was much less active and often spent all of his time hiding. He ate less (like it was less fun to eat if there was no one to fight with over the food) and he wouldn't even socialize with people at feeding time anymore.

Back when the land dwelling adult (she has been an exclusively land dwelling adult for 1 1/2 years, so she moved in with my older jeuvies) lived in the same tank she would come out and visit others who entered her domain. If nothing else they are highly curious about the actions of their fellow newt.

Even my jeuvies display social like behavior, occasionally following each other around through the tank. Strange thing about jeuvies is that they never fight. I often see them going nose to nose before heading their separate ways. It is funny because there are days when it is like...hey everybody let's climb this plant and they are all out climbing the plants. You often see one jeuvie sitting atop another on the same leaf, like and assertion of dominance. It is like boy-scouts or something so yeah, I would say they have social interactions. Oh, and once i saw one jeuvie riding the back of another towards a delicious fly which was climbing the wall, when they got close enough he stepped on his brother's head and got the food. Was this the most exciting thing that ever happened in my life? Apparently so. Why is my life sooooo boring? Perhaps it is because i am so slow to reply to e-mails (sorry Rob)

I can't believe I am using clip art. Tee hee, so lame. No really, we all know it is!

But I do agree, if you see a bundle of them huddling together (usually on a land mass) it is because there are not enough adequate hiding places. You often see this when stores get in jeuveniles which are not properly maintained and are put in an aquatic environment, then they all are stuck on one floating log. Also I saw some huddling once in a Wal-Mart where there were probably more than 20 adult CFBs kept in 2cm of water in what appeared to be a 15gal tank with no filter and fed fish food (I was traumatized, lord only knows haw the newts felt)

Jen
Yes it does it hit 30C quite often in Canada (Silly American). I am on the east coast and it is generally cool here (due to being on the ocean) but we frequently get up to 35C in late July and August. Mind you I doubt we will see any good weather this year, it is cold, cold, cold and wet, as it is all along the east coast of the States. It is my impression that Southern ontario is warmer than here though and probably goes above 30C more frequently.

Tara

 

[jennifer]

I think it depends on your definition of "social". Yes, they interact. But a newt alone is not "deprived", the way many mammals would be. At least that's my opinion.

Wow, 30C in Canada. I thought it was nothing but The Great White North up there!

Silly American

 

[fishian]

Yup sometimes it even gets up to 40 but thats just because of all the pollution caused by downtown toronto, almost every super hot day is also a smog advisory day.

Thank you all for the different impressions I guess Ill do a bit more reading and let you know what I do and how it goes.